Quote:You do not know me personally, Brian, so quit trying to act like you do.

We know your type.  Stop thinking you are so fucking unique.  There have been busloads of god-blowers here before you.  You're just one more.

And another thing, you are going to have a horrible stay here if you think people hate you personally. You need to learn to separate YOU from the claims you make.

Yes, horrible logic annoys me, but that is all you are seeing from me. Maybe you need to consider the fact that many of us here used to be where you are at, and many of us here already know the arguments you are making. You also need to consider that you are not really trying to convince us, but convince yourself. Swallowing something first is not how good logic works.

Again, I am being very fair to you and would treat anyone of any religion the same way.

1. When you make claims of truth about the nature of reality you have no good reason to bitch when someone says, "Prove it'.

2. You also have no good reason to assume you are the only one in the world with a religion, so don't act like it. 

Now, if we were discussing other things, like sports or music or movies or politics, we might find some agreement on those things depending on topic. But right now you are attempting to debate science. 

Criticism and blasphemy are what you are going to encounter on an atheist page. It is ok if you are too sensitive to handle it. If that is the case then maybe this website is not a good fit for you.

If you do anything, just be honest and admit YOU ARE trying to end all this with your God as the answer. 

But, the problem is still "which one" because other people of other religions ALSO try to get science to point to their clubs.

Now do you have the intellectual honesty to do this, or are you simply going to keep going in circles forever?

---

You want to follow real scientists?

Lawrence Krauss
Brian Greene
Neil Degrasse Tyson
Stephen Hawking

Those are the scientists you need to listen to, not the apologist who unfortunately sold you your elaborate apology.

(August 10, 2017 at 2:09 pm)Godscreated Wrote:

(August 10, 2017 at 3:01 am)Nay_Sayer Wrote: Sup, That wasn't a response, In fact, it seems your still throwing a tantrum.

Have a blessed day. RAmen

 I'm not like some of the childish atheist here, I do not throw tantrums, that's the response of the gang. 

GC

You sure? Becuase it's precisely what you're doing.

I digress, Anything else you'd like to mention as you lay on your fainting couch and recall all the mean ol oppression your getting? 

Creationist historical sciences? Is that an oxymoron or just moronic?

What passes for christen historical science?

(August 10, 2017 at 3:00 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Stop it, this is NOT ABOUT YOU..... That is the other thing your religion unfortunately feeds you, any criticism of it you falsely play victim.

No I do not know you that is correct. I have however over 16 years seen those same horrible chess moves made by other apologists.

Yes you can talk all day about science but in the end your goal is to plug in the God of the bible. 

ID is NOT SCIENCE, your God is not needed to explain how or why biological life exists.

Exploding stars explain why matter exists and thus atoms, and atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists, because atoms exist.

I am sorry it bothers you that I am not swallowing your delusion, but that is your baggage, not mine.

Why do you keep telling me what my goal is? You know my intentions without knowing me?

And...no need to apologize.  It does not bother me that you don't believe in God. You have that right. I am also happy not to talk with you about God since you clearly don't want me to.

However, I still reserve the right to ask a question or make a comment that implies that science doesn't really have an answer for something.  If you want to take that as my plug for God, you will have to deal with it. Alternatively, look at what I say and evaluate it on its face and don't make the leap.  It is up to you.

Lastly, your quote:

"Exploding stars explain why matter exists and thus atoms, and atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists, because atoms exist."

is fallacious (reification) as well as nonsense. Nothing is that simple. If you, personally, don't go deeper than that, I can see why you wouldn't question anything in science.

---

(August 10, 2017 at 3:24 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: You don't know what I am and am not skeptical of, so I'd recommend you follow the advice you just gave Brian and quit pretending like you know me when in fact you don't.

True that I don't know what you are skeptical of.  That is why I worded it "It seems". That has quite a different meaning than "You are". Brian's comments are like the latter.

---

(August 10, 2017 at 3:24 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:You do not know me personally, Brian, so quit trying to act like you do.

We know your type.  Stop thinking you are so fucking unique.  There have been busloads of god-blowers here before you.  You're just one more.

Heck, if I am the only Christian that has shown up here that doesn't have to talk about God but can ask relevant questions regarding science, then I am unique.

(August 10, 2017 at 4:36 pm)rjh4 is back Wrote:

(August 10, 2017 at 3:00 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Stop it, this is NOT ABOUT YOU..... That is the other thing your religion unfortunately feeds you, any criticism of it you falsely play victim.

No I do not know you that is correct. I have however over 16 years seen those same horrible chess moves made by other apologists.

Yes you can talk all day about science but in the end your goal is to plug in the God of the bible. 

ID is NOT SCIENCE, your God is not needed to explain how or why biological life exists.

Exploding stars explain why matter exists and thus atoms, and atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists, because atoms exist.

I am sorry it bothers you that I am not swallowing your delusion, but that is your baggage, not mine.

Why do you keep telling me what my goal is? You know my intentions without knowing me?

And...no need to apologize.  It does not bother me that you don't believe in God. You have that right. I am also happy not to talk with you about God since you clearly don't want me to.

However, I still reserve the right to ask a question or make a comment that implies that science doesn't really have an answer for something.  If you want to take that as my plug for God, you will have to deal with it. Alternatively, look at what I say and evaluate it on its face and don't make the leap.  It is up to you.

Lastly, your quote:

"Exploding stars explain why matter exists and thus atoms, and atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists, because atoms exist."

is fallacious (reification) as well as nonsense. Nothing is that simple. If you, personally, don't go deeper than that, I can see why you wouldn't question anything in science.

Your denial of my last comment proves you have no business at all debating science.

If you are going to suggest  I take your word for it and  deny that say over a QM scientist like Lawrence Krauss who says the material in you and I and all life are atoms caused by the death of an exploding star, sorry wont do it.

I don't have to know you personally. You must not have good reading comprehension.

I have been at this for 16 years. I have seen this playbook from others long before we met. You are not the first to try to debunk science only to later try to shoehorn a god into the gap later. We have seen that plenty of times. And again, if you think Christianity is the only religion to try to get science to point to their club, you would be wrong.

Now if you don't like what Lawrence Krauss says he has a twitter page, go over there and argue with him.

(August 10, 2017 at 3:30 pm)Brian37 Wrote: And another thing, you are going to have a horrible stay here if you think people hate you personally. You need to learn to separate YOU from the claims you make.

Yes, horrible logic annoys me, but that is all you are seeing from me. Maybe you need to consider the fact that many of us here used to be where you are at, and many of us here already know the arguments you are making. You also need to consider that you are not really trying to convince us, but convince yourself. Swallowing something first is not how good logic works.

Again, I am being very fair to you and would treat anyone of any religion the same way.

1. When you make claims of truth about the nature of reality you have no good reason to bitch when someone says, "Prove it'.

2. You also have no good reason to assume you are the only one in the world with a religion, so don't act like it. 

Now, if we were discussing other things, like sports or music or movies or politics, we might find some agreement on those things depending on topic. But right now you are attempting to debate science. 

Criticism and blasphemy are what you are going to encounter on an atheist page. It is ok if you are too sensitive to handle it. If that is the case then maybe this website is not a good fit for you.

If you do anything, just be honest and admit YOU ARE trying to end all this with your God as the answer. 

But, the problem is still "which one" because other people of other religions ALSO try to get science to point to their clubs.

Now do you have the intellectual honesty to do this, or are you simply going to keep going in circles forever?

---

You are laughable, Brian.

I don't think anyone here hates me. Even if they did...it wouldn't matter to me.

I will not admit that I am trying to end all this like you say.  It would be nice. But I did not come here to try to do that nor did I expect it. You will just have to live with that.

So...here is something you shouldn't bitch about:

You said: "atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists"

Prove it! (and I will give you the starting premise that atoms make up biological life as a given) Tell me how the atoms came to be life.

---

(August 10, 2017 at 4:49 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Your denial of my last comment proves you have no business at all debating science.

If you are going to suggest  I take your word for it and  deny that say over a QM scientist like Lawrence Krauss who says the material in you and I and all life are atoms caused by the death of an exploding star, sorry wont do it.

I don't have to know you personally. You must not have good reading comprehension.

I have been at this for 16 years. I have seen this playbook from others long before we met. You are not the first to try to debunk science only to later try to shoehorn a god into the gap later. We have seen that plenty of times. And again, if you think Christianity is the only religion to try to get science to point to their club, you would be wrong.

Now if you don't like what Lawrence Krauss says he has a twitter page, go over there and argue with him.

I don't suggest you take anybody's word for it. Even given that the material in you and me are atoms caused by the death of an exploding star, it doesn't explain how life came from non-life. If you think that is a sufficient explanation without more, you are delusional.

---

And I have no interest in debunking science. I love science. But I will question things that simply don't add up. Seems to me the questioning is part of the scientific method. Embrace it, Brian!

---

(August 10, 2017 at 4:25 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: Creationist historical sciences? Is that an oxymoron or just moronic?

What passes for christen historical science?

Um...science that deals with things that happened in the past.

---

I almost forgot:

Quote:You want to follow real scientists?

"true Scotsman fallacy"

(August 10, 2017 at 4:55 pm)rjh4 is back Wrote:

(August 10, 2017 at 3:30 pm)Brian37 Wrote: And another thing, you are going to have a horrible stay here if you think people hate you personally. You need to learn to separate YOU from the claims you make.

Yes, horrible logic annoys me, but that is all you are seeing from me. Maybe you need to consider the fact that many of us here used to be where you are at, and many of us here already know the arguments you are making. You also need to consider that you are not really trying to convince us, but convince yourself. Swallowing something first is not how good logic works.

Again, I am being very fair to you and would treat anyone of any religion the same way.

1. When you make claims of truth about the nature of reality you have no good reason to bitch when someone says, "Prove it'.

2. You also have no good reason to assume you are the only one in the world with a religion, so don't act like it. 

Now, if we were discussing other things, like sports or music or movies or politics, we might find some agreement on those things depending on topic. But right now you are attempting to debate science. 

Criticism and blasphemy are what you are going to encounter on an atheist page. It is ok if you are too sensitive to handle it. If that is the case then maybe this website is not a good fit for you.

If you do anything, just be honest and admit YOU ARE trying to end all this with your God as the answer. 

But, the problem is still "which one" because other people of other religions ALSO try to get science to point to their clubs.

Now do you have the intellectual honesty to do this, or are you simply going to keep going in circles forever?

---

You are laughable, Brian.

I don't think anyone here hates me. Even if they did...it wouldn't matter to me.

I will not admit that I am trying to end all this like you say.  It would be nice. But I did not come here to try to do that nor did I expect it. You will just have to live with that.

So...here is something you shouldn't bitch about:

You said: "atoms make up biological life and that explains why life exists"

Prove it! (and I will give you the starting premise that atoms make up biological life as a given) Tell me how the atoms came to be life.

---

(August 10, 2017 at 4:49 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Your denial of my last comment proves you have no business at all debating science.

If you are going to suggest  I take your word for it and  deny that say over a QM scientist like Lawrence Krauss who says the material in you and I and all life are atoms caused by the death of an exploding star, sorry wont do it.

I don't have to know you personally. You must not have good reading comprehension.

I have been at this for 16 years. I have seen this playbook from others long before we met. You are not the first to try to debunk science only to later try to shoehorn a god into the gap later. We have seen that plenty of times. And again, if you think Christianity is the only religion to try to get science to point to their club, you would be wrong.

Now if you don't like what Lawrence Krauss says he has a twitter page, go over there and argue with him.

I don't suggest you take anybody's word for it. Even given that the material in you and me are atoms caused by the death of an exploding star, it doesn't explain how life came from non-life. If you think that is a sufficient explanation without more, you are delusional.

---

And I have no interest in debunking science. I love science. But I will question things that simply don't add up. Seems to me the questioning is part of the scientific method. Embrace it, Brian!

You love science only when it doesn't conflict with your religious beliefs. You scream bloody murder or chalk it off to metaphor when science doesn't agree with you. 

And again, you also keep ignoring that your religion isn't the only to try to get science to point to their club. Muslims and Jews and Hindus and Buddhists also try to either debunk science, or when that doesnt work, try to get science to point to their club.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gadadhara-...67628.html

http://thecenterforappliedjudaism.org/

http://www.islamreligion.com/category/34...oly-quran/

https://www.lionsroar.com/buddhism-scien...ersations/

So when you say, "Why cant I ask questions".

I say, all of you need to hash that out between your religions, figure out who got it right, then get back to me because you all think science points to your clubs. 

I''d say the better bet is that humans made those bad claims in antiquity because they didn't know any better.

Sure, you can ask other atheists here all sorts of questions, but when you are dealing with me, I don't like wading down the convoluted Yellow Brick Road, not yours, not any.

(August 10, 2017 at 5:17 pm)Brian37 Wrote: Sure, you can ask other atheists here all sorts of questions, but when you are dealing with me, I don't like wading down the convoluted Yellow Brick Road, not yours, not any.

Its your road, Brian. You are the one making the nonsense claims regarding non-life to life without supporting it with anything more than statements that beg the question. I am just calling you on it and you don't like it.

(August 10, 2017 at 4:55 pm)rjh4 is back Wrote:

(August 10, 2017 at 4:25 pm)mh.brewer Wrote: Creationist historical sciences? Is that an oxymoron or just moronic?

What passes for christen historical science?

Um...science that deals with things that happened in the past.

Examples? (please be specific as possible)