(February 20, 2018 at 12:13 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote: Also I don't disagree with a lot of your other points, which is why I didn't respond to them.  I just disagree with the value of gun deaths as a stay.

Sorry, was that for me?

I'm not on the "no gun" side of this per se, but I did just want to point out that no guns actually would prevent a lot of suicides, CA. Actually, I believe I posted some stats on that further back in this thread. A great deal of suicides are unsuccessful, unless a gun is used. Additionally, a huge number of people only ever try once.

(February 20, 2018 at 11:36 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 11:22 am)wallym Wrote: Black folks peacefully playing along with the state's disarming of black neighborhoods might be overlooking some aspects of black history.  I think their wariness of the US government is more than a little justified.

Black folk attitudes is another mentality problem that need addressing. But that's for another thread...

Wtf??

(February 20, 2018 at 12:16 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 11:36 am)pocaracas Wrote: Black folk attitudes is another mentality problem that need addressing. But that's for another thread...

Wtf??

I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.  I assume he means repairing race relations to the point they don't have a reason to fear government.

(February 20, 2018 at 11:22 am)wallym Wrote: Black folks peacefully playing along with the state's disarming of black neighborhoods might be overlooking some aspects of black history.  I think their wariness of the US government is more than a little justified.

I drive through Ferguson, MO, several times a week. During the riots there it was the white boys that brought the guns.

(February 20, 2018 at 12:15 pm)Shell B Wrote: I'm not on the "no gun" side of this per se, but I did just want to point out that no guns actually would prevent a lot of suicides, CA. Actually, I believe I posted some stats on that further back in this thread. A great deal of suicides are unsuccessful, unless a gun is used. Additionally, a huge number of people only ever try once.

I dont know, is there evidence of that? I mean has gun regulation in the UK or Australia reduced suicide? It's a genuine question, if anybody knows the answer. You could be right though, I wouldn't want a suicidally depressed friend to have access to a gun. But it seems you can suicide with a rifle as well as anything.

My point stands about gun deaths being for propaganda and nothing else. A cancer victim who knowingly takes his own life with a gun doesn't belong in the same statistic with a child murder. How many of those 20000 gun suicides were people in their right mind?

It's propaghanda meant to make a problem look larger than it is. The important stats would be things like, the changes in murder rates with various gun control measures.

But people don't want that discussion for whatever reason. Even though it's the one that would help us all arrive at a real solution. Instead it always ends in a bunch of name calling and nonsense that goes nowhere.

Of course the right wing does it too were this forum more right leaning, I'd be addressing their silly arguments about guns preventing murders and such, just most atheist forum people are left wing so I need to address the nonsense that they say here.

Sadly don't think they realize at all that it just prevents coming to a solution, which can only happen when you work with, rather than against groups like the NRA.

(February 20, 2018 at 12:23 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: I drive through Ferguson, MO, several times a week. During the riots there it was the white boys that brought the guns.

Haven't all the mass shootings been perpetrated by white guys with guns?

(February 20, 2018 at 12:27 pm)Lutrinae Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 12:23 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: I drive through Ferguson, MO, several times a week. During the riots there it was the white boys that brought the guns.

Haven't all the mass shootings been perpetrated by white guys with guns?

No.

---

(February 20, 2018 at 12:15 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 12:13 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote: Also I don't disagree with a lot of your other points, which is why I didn't respond to them.  I just disagree with the value of gun deaths as a stay.

Sorry, was that for me?

No. Sorry. Just a fast moving thread. Hard to keep up.

(February 20, 2018 at 12:29 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 12:27 pm)Lutrinae Wrote: Haven't all the mass shootings been perpetrated by white guys with guns?

No.

From my perspective, Spanish guys still have white skin. Care to provide a link associating a black man to a mass shooting?

I don't know, Lut. Wasn't the Washington sniper black?

CA, yeah. There seems to be evidence to support that. https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/magazi...d-suicide/

So, I understand what you're saying. It's important to narrow down what the statistics mean in terms of murder. However, I don't see much of a difference between a murder and an accidental shooting if the same laws could prevent both. Again, I'm not anti-gun, but I could be persuaded to be if I thought we couldn't come up with good legislation to prevent the same number of deaths. Sure, you could remove the handful of suicides that could reasonably have been called euthanasia from the stats, but you'd still have a wild number of deaths from guns. I'm not sure distinctions mean much at that point. That being said, I can see why you believe acting like every gun death had a madman behind it is dishonest.

---

(February 20, 2018 at 12:16 pm)CapnAwesome Wrote:

(February 20, 2018 at 11:36 am)pocaracas Wrote: Black folk attitudes is another mentality problem that need addressing. But that's for another thread...

Wtf??

Yeah, I think if you read what he was responding to, it makes more sense. I double-taked on that too the first time around.