(March 22, 2018 at 11:13 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(March 22, 2018 at 11:07 am)Minimalist Wrote: That suggests to me that people are more honest now than they were in the 90's!

You'd have to look at what was being bought.

Bolts.  In the 90's...what would become the black rifle was still being snubbed at by target shooters.  The Clinton admin banned it by name (but hilariously didn't ban all of them..just ones with folding stocks and bayonet lugs) but it wouldn't take off until Obama got into office and even more specifically, after sandy hook.  The industry pumped money into 3-gun comps right before and even more after that, which require an "msr"  which is just a euphemism for an ar-15...and on the back of it's celebrity and that support it become -the- gun.  Good thing for the industry, because rifle sales were pretty much flat...the ar 15 and all of it's attachment opportunities was life support.

Here's guns and ammo in 81

Quote:"Most shooters and veteran riflemen look down their noses at these steel-stamped rifles as remnants from an erector set. The turn-bolt aficionado looks with a great deal of disdain at anybody toting one of these space-age rifles with plastic stocks and fore-ends. The dyed-in-the-wool deer hunter watching his domain being infiltrated by these black and gray guns assumes that these 'new generation' hunters are merely fantasizing 'war games' and are playing 'soldier.'"

Instead, the gun was mainly sold to law enforcement and other narrower demographics -- notably, "survivalists" who imagined they would one day face combat situations in an apocalyptic future, according to Tom Diaz, a gun expert and author of "Making a Killing: The Business of Guns in America."

Serious target shooters...as in..olympic level, still use a fortner .22b bolt. You can get an ar-15 a hell of alot cheaper, though. Personally..and I'm not a pro but a bigtime enthusiast...I use a savage .17wsm bolt.

More accurate than any of -my- 22's..massively cheaper than a fortner..ammos slightly more expensive..and I made the switch when bricks of 22 got scarce. For hunting, I;m moving from a 303 (never was a good fit but it's just a fetish) to a .270win bolt. Winchester is literally next door to me and the .17wsm and .270win I have share the action...so the whole routine is transferable from range to field.

(March 22, 2018 at 4:08 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(March 22, 2018 at 11:13 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: You'd have to look at what was being bought.

Bolts.  In the 90's...what would become the black rifle was still being snubbed at by target shooters.  The Clinton admin banned it by name (but hilariously didn't ban all of them..just ones with folding stocks and bayonet lugs) but it wouldn't take off until Obama got into office and even more specifically, after sandy hook.  The industry pumped money into 3-gun comps right before and even more after that, which require an "msr"  which is just a euphemism for an ar-15...and on the back of it's celebrity and that support it become -the- gun.  Good thing for the industry, because rifle sales were pretty much flat...the ar 15 and all of it's attachment opportunities was life support.  

Here's guns and ammo in 81

Quote:"Most shooters and veteran riflemen look down their noses at these steel-stamped rifles as remnants from an erector set. The turn-bolt aficionado looks with a great deal of disdain at anybody toting one of these space-age rifles with plastic stocks and fore-ends. The dyed-in-the-wool deer hunter watching his domain being infiltrated by these black and gray guns assumes that these 'new generation' hunters are merely fantasizing 'war games' and are playing 'soldier.'"

Instead, the gun was mainly sold to law enforcement and other narrower demographics -- notably, "survivalists" who imagined they would one day face combat situations in an apocalyptic future, according to Tom Diaz, a gun expert and author of "Making a Killing: The Business of Guns in America."

Serious target shooters...as in..olympic level, still use a fortner .22b bolt.  You can get an ar-15 a hell of alot cheaper, though. Personally..and I'm not a pro but a bigtime enthusiast...I use a savage .17wsm bolt.

More accurate than any of -my- 22's..massively cheaper than a fortner..ammos slightly more expensive..and I made the switch when bricks of 22 got scarce.  For hunting, I;m moving from a 303 (never was a good fit but it's just a fetish) to a .270win bolt.  Winchester is literally next door to me and the .17wsm and .270win I have share the action...so the whole routine is transferable from range to field.

@Jorg

LOL..true true.  I'll translate into non-gun nutter.

AR-15 not best best gun for target shooting or hunting.  Much better gun exist for either.  Ar-15 good at selling accessories and pistols.  Political climate good at selling ar-15 to nuts.

A great case of blackgunitis.

A national case, even...almost like an epidemic of ignorance or something. Everyone wants a shitty gun because everyone wants it..they;ve been told by people they hate they cant have it (so they want 12 of them..at least)..even though the only thing it;s good at is shooting at children and unarmed minorities...aside from costing them lots and lots of money.

-and here we are....Murica!

I've lost four pre-teen relatives to guns per year since 2000. Nobody is ever charged.

Even though the commission of both state and federal crimes is inevitable in each and every case.

Our gun problem, at least that gun problem, is not that we don't have applicable laws, but that we don't care that we have applicable laws and so pretend that we don't. Which is strange for law enforcement. Theyre not exactly the kind of folks we;d expect -not- to charge somebody with something in any other circumstance. If nothing else, it's a revenue stream.

(March 22, 2018 at 5:25 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: I've lost four pre-teen relatives to guns per year since 2000. Nobody is ever charged.

Dafuq? 72 people?  Did I read that right?

(March 22, 2018 at 5:51 pm)Fireball Wrote:

(March 22, 2018 at 5:25 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: I've lost four pre-teen relatives to guns per year since 2000. Nobody is ever charged.

Dafuq? 72 people?  Did I read that right?

72 pre-teens. Ain't no big thing 'round here.

(March 22, 2018 at 7:07 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(March 22, 2018 at 5:51 pm)Fireball Wrote: Dafuq? 72 people?  Did I read that right?

72 pre-teens. Ain't no big thing 'round here.

Shee-it! There is no one in my extended family (I have dozens of cousins) who has even been shot, let alone died from it. That's pretty ate up. I'm really sorry for your losses.