I did not discuss this with the staff before I wrote this, and I'm not writing it as a mod. This is an appeal to my fellow members.
Dear Atheist Forums -
When Shell invited me to join, I was nervous, apprehensive and excited. I had never been on a single forum before. I had barely interacted with strangers on the internet. I had only ever met two openly atheist people before and didn't know what to expect.
What I found was a community of individuals who make me laugh, who commiserate with each other, who support and encourage each other, who challenge and inform, who are willing to drink with each other on hangouts or chat when the chips are down, get outraged when bullshit happens and celebrate when humanitarian victories happen.
This goes for theists and atheists alike.
I won't pretend I didn't go through my own period of anti-theism and still get profoundly angry over things I see religion do. I do not believe in God and resent being told that I am less moral than the person who accepts Jesus or Allah or whatever. I won't go into a litany of all the things organized religion does; we've all heard it before. I am still against it, despite what I say below.
I also won't pretend that I don't consider myself a friend of some of the theists on here, and I WILL stand up and say I care about and adore them (and others in my life). I am aware also of the good things people have done in the name of religion, and what religion has done for some people. I don't agree that they necessarily needed religion to do it - I believe the seed of that goodness would have flowered with other types of cultivation - but that is neither here nor there.
For the most part - nay, for even the vast majority - the people on this site are good people. I don't care whether you necessarily believe what they do. At their hearts, they are humans struggling just like you do, individually.
There has been a growing trend of hostility on this site that pains me. I don't know if everyone is individually suffering more than usual and taking it out on forums, or if we're all growing disillusioned in some way, or...what.
I don't understand why it suddenly becomes so personal to see a bunch of people disagreeing with you over the internet. For the most part, the people on this site are adults. We ought to be able to 1) take disagreement in stride - if your beliefs (religion or otherwise) don't hold up under someone else's scrutiny, you have to decide why you hold to them and make peace with it; and 2) describe our disagreements with a reasonable amount of maturity that doesn't resort to calling someone evil, an idiot, a curseword of some sort, or a nazi.
I am probably one of the most easy-going "former" Jews you will meet, and it's starting to sicken me, btw, to see "nazi" tossed around. You are, firstly, acting no better than the people we mock on Fox News and secondly you are denigrating beyond measure an event we have yet to equal. You all know how passionate I am about the bullying of children and hatred of homosexuals and religious and economic bullshit I see from many of our American presidential hopefuls, and I'm telling you - none of it equals the systematic extermination of certain races, sexualities and religions or political factions.
We seem to have forgotten that many people come to this site for information or learning purposes. And despite recent arguments to the contrary, also for a sense of community. Not everyone comes here having already googled everything there is to know about atheism, religion, deism, secularism, or humanism. Not everyone has the time or resources to have found this information already. Not everyone comes from a background in which they have learned how to express themselves eloquently in writing to complete strangers. Theists may have come from a background in which preaching-type language was so normal they don't even recognize it anymore. It would be helpful if everyone kept their cool and made helpful suggestions to newcomers before jumping all over them - such as reminding them of the rules, pointing out what their language comes across as, and making sure new theists have seen our page for them.
The point of forums like these are to spread information and support. They are not merely a springboard for you to mock and belittle others.
I understand that the sentiment among atheists is that theists have a gaping hole in their logic center in regards to god, and that must make them stupid, but I'd like to point out that atheists are quite able to fall into the same trap with whatever their particular gris-gris is. Lack of god-belief does not automatically confer intelligence onto you, and belief does not necessarily make you an idiot. The head of the human genome project is a born-again, for chrissake.
I also understand that theists think we are arrogant and overwhelmingly asshole-ish. As has been stated before, we are sick of being treated worse than homosexuals or immigrants or various other religions. I do hope you understand how hurtful it is when you would rather us lie and even say we might not be religious but are "spiritual" in place of accepting that there might be a real, caring, loving person inside. It is insulting you would rather have a mask than our reality.
People come here who are on the fence. They will NOT be immediately convinced based on what you consider flawless logic or reasoning. Some of them may have heard all the tripe about us being this way simply for hating God. Some will have only found misinformation about a variety of subjects. Using a little compassion and empathy when you speak to others would go a lot - a fuck-load - further in the beginning when addressing them.
Save your vitriol for people who truly prove to be trolls - which you cannot always know within a few posts. Save it for people proven to be demonstrably and stubbornly ignorant, and for the charlatans who don't believe what they're peddling but try to profit off those they convert.
I admit I have been guilty of speech I probably shouldn't have let fly on this forum, and from now on will endeavor to continue refining my language and keeping it as civil as possible. I would ask, not as your Queen, not as a mod, but as a forum member who came here seeking what has become a loose family - please try to do the same.
It has been on my mind that maybe we should change some of the introductory/rule language to include other suggestions to help newcomers from the outset and I will be thinking about this and possibly take it up with the staff, but the real legwork belongs to all of us. Stop immediately calling people trolls, and try to get to know them first. For some of the longer-running members, stop being "butt-hurt" that they are still around. If you feel they are insulting in some manner, please talk to staff members - it's what we're here for. No one goes under our radar, no matter what you think. We are all on the staff because we're active members who try to read the majority of posts.
And, in the name of the invisible pink unicorn who even Ryft respects, when you feel you're getting angry over something someone on this board has said, get up and walk away for a minute. Pausing does not mean defeat, and when you come back you might find you see what they're writing in a new light. There is no reason to let yourself get upset over something a person in another state, country or continent has said. No one should feel they have to leave this board entirely because of a hostile environment.
If you made it this far, I thank you. I normally hate writing things like this because I don't want to be a bitch or overbearing, but the direction this place is going makes me heartsick.
If you have the time to watch it, I'd like to leave a link to the video of Phil Plait's "Don't Be a Dick" speech, which might be food for thought.
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badast...the-video/
And here, officially, I end my rant.
Dear Atheist Forums -
When Shell invited me to join, I was nervous, apprehensive and excited. I had never been on a single forum before. I had barely interacted with strangers on the internet. I had only ever met two openly atheist people before and didn't know what to expect.
What I found was a community of individuals who make me laugh, who commiserate with each other, who support and encourage each other, who challenge and inform, who are willing to drink with each other on hangouts or chat when the chips are down, get outraged when bullshit happens and celebrate when humanitarian victories happen.
This goes for theists and atheists alike.
I won't pretend I didn't go through my own period of anti-theism and still get profoundly angry over things I see religion do. I do not believe in God and resent being told that I am less moral than the person who accepts Jesus or Allah or whatever. I won't go into a litany of all the things organized religion does; we've all heard it before. I am still against it, despite what I say below.
I also won't pretend that I don't consider myself a friend of some of the theists on here, and I WILL stand up and say I care about and adore them (and others in my life). I am aware also of the good things people have done in the name of religion, and what religion has done for some people. I don't agree that they necessarily needed religion to do it - I believe the seed of that goodness would have flowered with other types of cultivation - but that is neither here nor there.
For the most part - nay, for even the vast majority - the people on this site are good people. I don't care whether you necessarily believe what they do. At their hearts, they are humans struggling just like you do, individually.
There has been a growing trend of hostility on this site that pains me. I don't know if everyone is individually suffering more than usual and taking it out on forums, or if we're all growing disillusioned in some way, or...what.
I don't understand why it suddenly becomes so personal to see a bunch of people disagreeing with you over the internet. For the most part, the people on this site are adults. We ought to be able to 1) take disagreement in stride - if your beliefs (religion or otherwise) don't hold up under someone else's scrutiny, you have to decide why you hold to them and make peace with it; and 2) describe our disagreements with a reasonable amount of maturity that doesn't resort to calling someone evil, an idiot, a curseword of some sort, or a nazi.
I am probably one of the most easy-going "former" Jews you will meet, and it's starting to sicken me, btw, to see "nazi" tossed around. You are, firstly, acting no better than the people we mock on Fox News and secondly you are denigrating beyond measure an event we have yet to equal. You all know how passionate I am about the bullying of children and hatred of homosexuals and religious and economic bullshit I see from many of our American presidential hopefuls, and I'm telling you - none of it equals the systematic extermination of certain races, sexualities and religions or political factions.
We seem to have forgotten that many people come to this site for information or learning purposes. And despite recent arguments to the contrary, also for a sense of community. Not everyone comes here having already googled everything there is to know about atheism, religion, deism, secularism, or humanism. Not everyone has the time or resources to have found this information already. Not everyone comes from a background in which they have learned how to express themselves eloquently in writing to complete strangers. Theists may have come from a background in which preaching-type language was so normal they don't even recognize it anymore. It would be helpful if everyone kept their cool and made helpful suggestions to newcomers before jumping all over them - such as reminding them of the rules, pointing out what their language comes across as, and making sure new theists have seen our page for them.
The point of forums like these are to spread information and support. They are not merely a springboard for you to mock and belittle others.
I understand that the sentiment among atheists is that theists have a gaping hole in their logic center in regards to god, and that must make them stupid, but I'd like to point out that atheists are quite able to fall into the same trap with whatever their particular gris-gris is. Lack of god-belief does not automatically confer intelligence onto you, and belief does not necessarily make you an idiot. The head of the human genome project is a born-again, for chrissake.
I also understand that theists think we are arrogant and overwhelmingly asshole-ish. As has been stated before, we are sick of being treated worse than homosexuals or immigrants or various other religions. I do hope you understand how hurtful it is when you would rather us lie and even say we might not be religious but are "spiritual" in place of accepting that there might be a real, caring, loving person inside. It is insulting you would rather have a mask than our reality.
People come here who are on the fence. They will NOT be immediately convinced based on what you consider flawless logic or reasoning. Some of them may have heard all the tripe about us being this way simply for hating God. Some will have only found misinformation about a variety of subjects. Using a little compassion and empathy when you speak to others would go a lot - a fuck-load - further in the beginning when addressing them.
Save your vitriol for people who truly prove to be trolls - which you cannot always know within a few posts. Save it for people proven to be demonstrably and stubbornly ignorant, and for the charlatans who don't believe what they're peddling but try to profit off those they convert.
I admit I have been guilty of speech I probably shouldn't have let fly on this forum, and from now on will endeavor to continue refining my language and keeping it as civil as possible. I would ask, not as your Queen, not as a mod, but as a forum member who came here seeking what has become a loose family - please try to do the same.
It has been on my mind that maybe we should change some of the introductory/rule language to include other suggestions to help newcomers from the outset and I will be thinking about this and possibly take it up with the staff, but the real legwork belongs to all of us. Stop immediately calling people trolls, and try to get to know them first. For some of the longer-running members, stop being "butt-hurt" that they are still around. If you feel they are insulting in some manner, please talk to staff members - it's what we're here for. No one goes under our radar, no matter what you think. We are all on the staff because we're active members who try to read the majority of posts.
And, in the name of the invisible pink unicorn who even Ryft respects, when you feel you're getting angry over something someone on this board has said, get up and walk away for a minute. Pausing does not mean defeat, and when you come back you might find you see what they're writing in a new light. There is no reason to let yourself get upset over something a person in another state, country or continent has said. No one should feel they have to leave this board entirely because of a hostile environment.
If you made it this far, I thank you. I normally hate writing things like this because I don't want to be a bitch or overbearing, but the direction this place is going makes me heartsick.
If you have the time to watch it, I'd like to leave a link to the video of Phil Plait's "Don't Be a Dick" speech, which might be food for thought.
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badast...the-video/
And here, officially, I end my rant.
![[Image: Untitled2_zpswaosccbr.png]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i1140.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fn569%2Fthesummerqueen%2FUntitled2_zpswaosccbr.png)
hock:
