I built this using the knowledge of the ancients, I did it through the night so no one would see me moving each stone by hand levitation, it only took me one night.

(August 22, 2018 at 7:35 am)possibletarian Wrote: I built this using the knowledge of the ancients, I did it through the night so no one would see me moving each stone by hand levitation, it only took me one night.

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That makes me want to go to Legoland again.


(To the OP)

Genesis 11:1-9 is an origin myth attempting to explain the diversity in languages. The problem was not with the tower as such, or the attempts to build it 'to the heavens' (even if that translation were correct), but with the city. The tower was probably a come-live-here feature of the city.

The city/tower was explicitly designed (v4) with the aim of preventing the dispersion of humanity around the earth. This was a direct challenge to the recently issued command in Genesis 9:1 “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth.”. (Also Genesis 1:28 “God blessed them and said to them, 'Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it.' ”)

In the myth, a diversity of languages was the mechanism used for ending the project, and getting humanity on the move around the world (v8,9).

The Pentecost speaking in tongues thing may be intended as a kind of reversal of Genesis 11.

(August 26, 2018 at 7:53 pm)Vicki Q Wrote: Genesis 11:1-9 is an origin myth attempting to explain the diversity in languages. The problem was not with the tower as such, or the attempts to build it 'to the heavens' (even if that translation were correct), but with the city. The tower was probably a come-live-here feature of the city.

This is where I perceive a problem.  Go back one step to Genesis 10, and we find the following

KJV 10: 31:  These are the sons of Shem, after their families, after their tongues, in their lands, after their nations.

NIV 10:31 These are the sons of Shem by their clans and languages, in their territories and nations.

So, the Tower of Babel confuses the languages after there were already multiple languages.  That confuses me.

I imagine that there are apologetics somewhere to explain this discrepancy, but I cannot be bothered chasing them up at the moment.

Norm

Huggy also thinks that the tortoise beat the hare because the hare was overconfident!

(August 26, 2018 at 8:43 pm)fromdownunder Wrote: I imagine that there are apologetics somewhere to explain this discrepancy, but I cannot be bothered chasing them up at the moment.

Norm

No, I can't either. You'd probably have to ask a fundie, which I'm not. It's a matter of non-importance IMHO.

In terms of the meta-narrative, the key points are

(1) Humanity was given by God stewardship of the world.

However they weren't prepared to go out and about and do the job. Probably people weren't able to get good wifi away from the city. Therefore God forces them out. So

(2) God expects us to carry out the task of establishing His Kingdom, and Bad Things happen if that's not the case.

You must be reading a different magic book, lol.  Or is it more the fact that we can't trust magic book to mean what it says, and say what it means?

(August 27, 2018 at 1:36 pm)Vicki Q Wrote: (2) God expects us to carry out the task of establishing His Kingdom, and Bad Things happen if that's not the case.

So, you're saying bad Christians are the reason bad things happen?

(August 26, 2018 at 8:43 pm)fromdownunder Wrote:

(August 26, 2018 at 7:53 pm)Vicki Q Wrote: Genesis 11:1-9 is an origin myth attempting to explain the diversity in languages. The problem was not with the tower as such, or the attempts to build it 'to the heavens' (even if that translation were correct), but with the city. The tower was probably a come-live-here feature of the city.

This is where I perceive a problem.  Go back one step to Genesis 10, and we find the following

KJV 10: 31:  These are the sons of Shem, after their families, after their tongues, in their lands, after their nations.

NIV 10:31 These are the sons of Shem by their clans and languages, in their territories and nations.

So, the Tower of Babel confuses the languages after there were already multiple languages.  That confuses me.

I imagine that there are apologetics somewhere to explain this discrepancy, but I cannot be bothered chasing them up at the moment.

Norm

Indeed.

The one who seems to be confused is God Himself. He's ordained it both ways, which is whack a doodle.

(August 27, 2018 at 5:11 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote:

(August 27, 2018 at 1:36 pm)Vicki Q Wrote: (2) God expects us to carry out the task of establishing His Kingdom, and Bad Things happen if that's not the case.

So, you're saying bad Christians are the reason bad things happen?

So we should kill the "bad" christians? Wait, what?

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(August 15, 2018 at 11:26 am)Cyberman Wrote:

(August 15, 2018 at 11:21 am)Abaddon_ire Wrote: Great, if true. Unfortunately for you it doesn't mean that at all. Not even close.

I'm afraid it does, or at least it's derived from it.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/babel

Way to kill the Huggytrap. Next time maybe.

Quote: (2) God expects us to carry out the task of establishing His Kingdom, and Bad Things happen if that's not the case.

Your "god" seems terribly inept.  Why do you call him "god?"