Time to embrace Pastafarianism. There is still time.

RAmen

---

(November 29, 2019 at 7:14 pm)Apathyst Wrote:

(November 29, 2019 at 5:23 pm)brewer Wrote: Nope. You pay a bit more attention to what you worship.

Careful sport In 1889, in the US a girl could legally consent to sex at 10, 11, or 12 in half the states, and in Delaware the age of consent was 7” according to wiki.

Whataboutism. Still makes moohamed a pedo.

FSM weaps.

(November 29, 2019 at 3:49 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: I've been listening lately to famous non religious figures (Dawkins, Hitchens, etc.) in popular youtube videos presenting Islam as just another fake religion out there, that all Muslims should move on and leave their nonsensical faith etc etc.

What is surprising though is this : Dawkins for example never read the Qur'an as he admitted years ago in one of his tweets, Hitchens really isn't the best example of an objective critic of religion, since everything with the word God is evil for the guy. Also in one of his articles he mentions the satanic verses incident as evidence that islam's holy book just as fabricated as the Bible and other sacred texts, even though the incident's occurence was largely disproved by professional Muslim theologians such as al-Albani, who wrote a whole book for this matter.

How can Hitchens or anyone completely ignorant of Islamic theology present such lies to the general public, and assumes that every other religion is just as nonsensical as the one he used to believe in ? How can they speak with a confident tone about a religion they don't understand at all ?

My point is that Islam really is misunderstood and non muslims generally don't make any effort to look up deeper, and not give in to what popular opinion says about it.

And as to why one should embrace Islam or at least consider it seriously, the reason is this : the core belief makes much more sense than its christian counterpart, no Trinity and no God dying for anybody's sins or any obvious logical impossibility, also proving the Qur'an authenticity is a much simpler case since the original text is preserved unlike the Old and New testament.

Another reason is that famous objections to faith such as the problem of evil are resolved in a satisfactory way within Islam. Christianity teaches that God is all loving, this attribute, which is apparently desirable, obviously contradicts the fact that some people - whom the christian God loves - will spend eternity in helll. Islam says that love is earned, that one who claims to love God should really follow his path, and therefore anyone who consciously and willingly rejects his message -knowing its true- doesn't deserve to be loved by his creator.

I hope the points mentioned will at least make you reconsider what you think you know about Islam

The source of Islam -which is the Quran- is clear and have no problem. The problem is many Shiite/Sunni Muslims who bring Arabic text like the Hadith books and mix it with the Quran, then the result is a perfect religion for Dawkins to pick up on.

---

OP said:

Quote:Christianity teaches that God is all loving, this attribute, which is apparently desirable

But the bible said:

Quote:“This is what the Lord Almighty says... ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)

In other verses "donkey" means cock.

(November 30, 2019 at 2:07 am)Nay_Sayer Wrote: Time to embrace Pastafarianism. There is still time.

RAmen

---

[quote='Apathyst' pid='1944698' dateline='1575069281']

Whataboutism. Still makes moohamed a pedo.

FSM weaps.

In the immortal words of the mightiest giant who ever puned poorly, I don’t think that word means what you think it means. See I was not minimizing rape of a child ( even if it wasn’t technically rape you know age of consent married her first and all that. Statutory rape being just that statutory so if you comply with the statutes as they were, which he apparently did, it couldn’t be rape. Try not to confuse legality with morality and while you’re at it try not to impose one eras moral judgements on another era. And no I do not suggest in any way that anyone should be screwing 9 year olds, married or not, I was just pointing out the comment seemed more racist based than logical argument based, you know, the tone Of the language the characature the details just jumped out. But go ahead smug away it’s a good look on you.

Whataboutisms indeed FSM truly weeps you got that part right...

OP: "Time to embrace Islam. Why? Because Ad hominem logical fallacy toward Dawkins and Hitchens."

So is this topic about Islam or Dawkins and Hitchens?

BTW, Klorophyll, do you think you have better chance converting Christians into Islam or Atheists? Because it seems Christians have much lower opinion about Islam than non believers.

Here's how Christians see Muslims from their movie "God's not dead"





Seems to me it is in your interest to have a lot of atheists because, without the common enemy, Muslims and Christians would be back at killing each other over whose religion is the right one. Also, if you had more atheists in your own Muslim countries you wouldn't be killing each other over which Muslim denomination is right, like it is in western countries - they have a lot of atheists so Christians are not killing themselves anymore about which is the right Christian denomination.

(November 29, 2019 at 3:49 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: I've been listening lately to famous non religious figures (Dawkins, Hitchens, etc.) in popular youtube videos presenting Islam as just another fake religion out there, that all Muslims should move on and leave their nonsensical faith etc etc.

What is surprising though is this : Dawkins for example never read the Qur'an as he admitted years ago in one of his tweets, Hitchens really isn't the best example of an objective critic of religion, since everything with the word God is evil for the guy. Also in one of his articles he mentions the satanic verses incident as evidence that islam's holy book just as fabricated as the Bible and other sacred texts, even though the incident's occurence was largely disproved by professional Muslim theologians such as al-Albani, who wrote a whole book for this matter.

How can Hitchens or anyone completely ignorant of Islamic theology present such lies to the general public, and assumes that every other religion is just as nonsensical as the one he used to believe in ? How can they speak with a confident tone about a religion they don't understand at all ?

My point is that Islam really is misunderstood and non muslims generally don't make any effort to look up deeper, and not give in to what popular opinion says about it.

And as to why one should embrace Islam or at least consider it seriously, the reason is this : the core belief makes much more sense than its christian counterpart, no Trinity and no God dying for anybody's sins or any obvious logical impossibility, also proving the Qur'an authenticity is a much simpler case since the original text is preserved unlike the Old and New testament.

Another reason is that famous objections to faith such as the problem of evil are resolved in a satisfactory way within Islam. Christianity teaches that God is all loving, this attribute, which is apparently desirable, obviously contradicts the fact that some people - whom the christian God loves - will spend eternity in helll. Islam says that love is earned, that one who claims to love God should really follow his path, and therefore anyone who consciously and willingly rejects his message -knowing its true- doesn't deserve to be loved by his creator.

I hope the points mentioned will at least make you reconsider what you think you know about Islam

Islam appeals to the supernatural and I don't think that the supernatural is a real thing.

Until you prove the existence of any god, arguing about which one is the right one is like arguing which fairy has the shiniest wings.

(November 29, 2019 at 11:20 pm)Apathyst Wrote:

(November 29, 2019 at 11:01 pm)brewer Wrote: And what does that say about the religious man asking/chasing/manipulating,.... sport?

That it is pointless to bring pedos into the argument since they can be found among all flavors of woo and non woo alike especially when you focus on a specific target it almost projects a certain hint of racism. But maybe it’s just me and your Milage  May vary so take it for what it’s worth. Cary on then, off you go you non racist you.

Not much for the touted religious morals then. No higher road, not much point.

(November 29, 2019 at 3:49 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: I've been listening lately to famous non religious figures (Dawkins, Hitchens, etc.) in popular youtube videos presenting Islam as just another fake religion out there, that all Muslims should move on and leave their nonsensical faith etc etc.

What is surprising though is this : Dawkins for example never read the Qur'an as he admitted years ago in one of his tweets, Hitchens really isn't the best example of an objective critic of religion, since everything with the word God is evil for the guy. Also in one of his articles he mentions the satanic verses incident as evidence that islam's holy book just as fabricated as the Bible and other sacred texts, even though the incident's occurence was largely disproved by professional Muslim theologians such as al-Albani, who wrote a whole book for this matter.

How can Hitchens or anyone completely ignorant of Islamic theology present such lies to the general public, and assumes that every other religion is just as nonsensical as the one he used to believe in ? How can they speak with a confident tone about a religion they don't understand at all ?

My point is that Islam really is misunderstood and non muslims generally don't make any effort to look up deeper, and not give in to what popular opinion says about it.

And as to why one should embrace Islam or at least consider it seriously, the reason is this : the core belief makes much more sense than its christian counterpart, no Trinity and no God dying for anybody's sins or any obvious logical impossibility, also proving the Qur'an authenticity is a much simpler case since the original text is preserved unlike the Old and New testament.

Another reason is that famous objections to faith such as the problem of evil are resolved in a satisfactory way within Islam. Christianity teaches that God is all loving, this attribute, which is apparently desirable, obviously contradicts the fact that some people - whom the christian God loves - will spend eternity in helll. Islam says that love is earned, that one who claims to love God should really follow his path, and therefore anyone who consciously and willingly rejects his message -knowing its true- doesn't deserve to be loved by his creator.

I hope the points mentioned will at least make you reconsider what you think you know about Islam

Why? Your nonsene is as unreal and stupid as Bergoglio's.

Quote:In other verses "donkey" means cock.

Oh, please.  The early Christians may not have been the sharpest knives in the drawer, but I'm sure they knew the difference between a donkey and a rooster.

Boru

(November 29, 2019 at 8:06 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: In the interest of erring on the side of caution, I've removed the image I posted.

Boru

That's better. I hope brewer does the same and removes the stereotyped nonsense picture he posted.

(November 29, 2019 at 9:17 pm)Apathyst Wrote: No, you so clearly do not. Not the tiniest tinciest bit, but that’s ok. Feel free to go around trying to convince people your unicorn poop is best even though no one claims to have seen a unicorn for the last 2000 years and those guys were pretty sketchy to begin with. But the minute you start getting the urge to force me to say your unicorn poop is the best and make me do what you say the unicorn poop says because only you are special enough to hear it, just stop and tickle your self, kiss a girl, anything to make that urge go away because if you act on it I will end you. [for you mouth breathers that was not intended as a threat nor was it a threat I meerly expressed the US national policy which is that people are free to worship unicorn poop but the minute they strap on a suicide bomb vest or hi-jack a plane they will be hunted down and killed and the US has a tendency not to be terribly discriminating when Islamic Jihadis are mixed in with just regular folks they don’t even have to be Muslim apparently Sikh is close enough for some of our “heros”(notice the air quotes? Means my use of hero is sarcastic) no part of my comment was directed at any actual person so flame away but just not about that.

How did you end up talking about suicide bombs ? Are you out of your minds people ?

---

(November 29, 2019 at 10:15 pm)Grandizer Wrote: I'm not sure how you see this as evidence for Islam being true?

Just because the Qur'an was [supposedly] the most eloquently written Arabic book doesn't mean Islam is more likely to be true than other religions. It certainly doesn't mean Islam is more likely to be true than atheism.

I think you missed the point of the argument, the Qur'an isn't [just] the most eloquent piece of Arabic literature, it also challenged everybody else to come up with something comparable. Also, Muhammad didn't show up out of nowhere and told the arab clans : look at my 600+ pages eloquent book of epic proportions, because in which case one can simply say he took dozens of years preparing and polishing the book with the help of the most talented linguists etc. the words were uttered almost spontaneously by Muhammad according to the situation.

The bottom line is that the way the Qur'an came into being cannot be explained (unless you have a reasonable explanation) by natural events.

---

(November 30, 2019 at 2:12 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: The source of Islam -which is the Quran- is clear and have no problem. The problem is many Shiite/Sunni Muslims who bring Arabic text like the Hadith books and mix it with the Quran, then the result is a perfect religion for Dawkins to pick up on.

Dawkins didn't read the Qur'an nor the hadiths, and he reportedly says he can't quote any of the Islamic sources as well as he does with the Bible. Also, some quranic verses simply don't make sense once you omit all the hadith books.

Even the number of prayers per day isn't mentioned in the Qur'an! Can you pray the correct Islamic way according to what's on the Qur'an alone? Good luck.

(November 30, 2019 at 2:12 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: But the bible said:

Quote:“This is what the Lord Almighty says... ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)

In other verses "donkey" means cock.

I am aware that the bible and especially the Old Testament contains horrible stories of genocides etc. But for christians that still doesn't disprove the omnibenevolence of God. So they try to reconcile these two impossibilities.

Do you know what atheist means?