The attitude of a Muslim towards non-belief and to non-believers has been a source of constant criticism of the Quran; claimed by many to be "extremist and non-tolerant" towards non-belief.

But the contents of the Quran are the exact opposite. Reading the verses in the Quran regarding how to treat non-belief and non-believers can tell us a lot:

1- Sura 2, 256:

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 256 )   There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

This ancient verse can be located in Sura 2, verse 256. It's obvious as daylight: compulsion and enforcing of Islam is highly forbidden, since the right course is clear from the wrong.

2-Sura 60, 8:

Quote:Sura 60, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 8 )   Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous toward them and acting justly toward them. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.

This ancient verse can be located in Sura 60, verse 8. It's also obvious as daylight, that being "just" and "righteous" towards non-believers who don't fight Muslims because of their choice of faith is a cause of God's love.

Other implicit meanings of tolerance towards peaceful non-believers are also present and numerous in the Quran.

I should note that these verses existed since 1400 years with archeological evidence on their side:

https://atheistforums.org/thread-60183.html

A quick google search returns as many reasons for muslims to kill non-believers as it does to treat us well.
This is not surprising, like most religions it likes to cover all bases.

here for example.

https://www.politicalislam.com/sharia-la...the-kafir/

Quote:w59.2 […] And this clarifies the Koranic verses and hadiths about hatred for the sake of Allah and love for the sake of Allah, Al Walaa wa al Baraa, being unyielding towards the Kafirs, hard against them, and detesting them, while accepting the destiny of Allah Most High insofar as it is the decree of Allah Mighty and Majestic.
Hatred for the sake of Allah and love for the sake of Allah is called Al Walaa wa al Baraa, a fundamental principle of Islamic ethics and Sharia. A Muslim is to hate what Allah hates and love what Allah loves. Allah hates the Kafir, therefore, a Muslim is to act accordingly.

You can find similar nice and nasty bits in all faiths.

(December 23, 2019 at 7:07 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: The attitude of a Muslim towards non-belief and to non-believers has been a source of constant criticism of the Quran; claimed by many to be "extremist and non-tolerant" towards non-belief.

But the contents of the Quran are the exact opposite. Reading the verses in the Quran regarding how to treat non-belief and non-believers can tell us a lot:

1- Sura 2, 256:

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 256 )   There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

This ancient verse can be located in Sura 2, verse 256. It's obvious as daylight: compulsion and enforcing of Islam is highly forbidden, since the right course is clear from the wrong.

2-Sura 60, 8:

Quote:Sura 60, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 8 )   Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous toward them and acting justly toward them. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly.

This ancient verse can be located in Sura 60, verse 8. It's also obvious as daylight, that being "just" and "righteous" towards non-believers who don't fight Muslims because of their choice of faith is a cause of God's love.

Other implicit meanings of tolerance towards peaceful non-believers are also present and numerous in the Quran.

I should note that these verses existed since 1400 years with archeological evidence on their side:

https://atheistforums.org/thread-60183.html

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

Boru

Atass sees what he wants to see. As usual.

(December 23, 2019 at 7:15 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: 2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

Boru

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#aya=2_187

2:190  Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

2:192  And if they cease, then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

---

(December 23, 2019 at 7:29 am)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Atass sees what he wants to see. As usual.

Help me understand this: so Muslims have no right to deter aggression by fighting back with the condition of ceasing if the other side ceases, as 2:192 of the Quran stated?

'And slay them wherever ye find them' is an exhortation to do murder, solely on the basis of unbelief, full stop.  The 'cease and desist' is no expiation of it.

Boru

Quote:persecution is worse than slaughter

Is it?

(December 23, 2019 at 7:55 am)Deesse23 Wrote:

Quote:persecution is worse than slaughter

Is it?

It depends on which end of the sword you happen to be.

Boru

(December 23, 2019 at 7:32 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#aya=2_187

2:190  Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.

2:191 And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

Help me understand this: so Muslims have no right to deter aggression by fighting back with the condition of ceasing if the other side ceases, as 2:192 of the Quran stated?

It doesnt say "fight back" and no ,it doesnt say "deter agression". It says "slay them wherever ye find them" and then repeats by saying "but if they attack you then slay them".
How do you reconcile that with "but do not transgress"?

'Deter aggression' generally translates as 'I thought he was going to hit me so I hit him back first'.

Boru