(July 30, 2020 at 11:53 pm)Gnomey Wrote: My dad went to Bible College in his youth, and they had guest speakers come in and give sermons sometimes. On one such occasion, the speaker was the head of the college. She gave a sermon about Jesus turning water into wine, but had to make it clear to everyone that "he didn't turn it into real wine though because Jesus wouldn't turn water into something that makes men beat their wives."

And he wonders why I'm an atheist now. 🤷‍♀️

(To be clear: my dad definitely doesn't hold the same view of alcohol = bad; he gave me a proper education in craft beer before I flew the nest. But like, yeah. Those Christian bastards will think of anything to uphold their own version of Jesus as "The Way.")

Nice one Gnomey.
I'll go one further and say if people didn't read the bible at all, they wouldn't beat their wives, slaves, gays or fig trees!

It can be assumed Jesus drank wine, both because of the processes and the custom available. He certainly offered it, as did God. It's a bringer of joy to the heart according to the Bible. The only self-prohibition from just drinking wine I know of was the Rekobites in Jerimiah. God specifically commanded they be offered wine, but they refused for their family beliefs. Daniel abstained temporarily because of who offered it, not because of what it was. Lot and Noah were drunks and abusers, but if anything, that served as a lesson. Leviticus does give a specific example of a time when God commanded certain people for a certain reason not to drink wine at all. I'm not Aaron or his sons, nor do I plan on entering the tent of meeting. Nor am I a king and ruler as it says in Proverbs (even though that was is so they don't "forget what has been decreed"). Still waiting for a valid verse. This seems a little futile. Are people arguing that wine is bad and a sin or that drinking wine is bad or a sin or that getting drunk is a sin?

(July 31, 2020 at 9:00 am)tackattack Wrote: It can be assumed Jesus drank wine, both because of the processes and the custom available. He certainly offered it, as did God. It's a bringer of joy to the heart according to the Bible. The only self-prohibition from just drinking wine I know of was the Rekobites in Jerimiah. God specifically commanded they be offered wine, but they refused for their family beliefs. Daniel abstained temporarily because of who offered it, not because of what it was. Lot and Noah were drunks and abusers, but if anything, that served as a lesson. Leviticus does give a specific example of a time when God commanded certain people for a certain reason not to drink wine at all. I'm not Aaron or his sons, nor do I plan on entering the tent of meeting. Nor am I a king and ruler as it says in Proverbs (even though that was is so they don't "forget what has been decreed"). Still waiting for a valid verse. This seems a little futile. Are people arguing that wine is bad and a sin or that drinking wine is bad or a sin or that getting drunk is a sin?

Quote:Leviticus 10:9

9 Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations:

Quote:Numbers 6:3

3 He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink, and shall drink no vinegar of wine, or vinegar of strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grapes, nor eat moist grapes, or dried.

Boru

Perhaps you didn't read that sentence because you were just waiting to argue your point.
"Leviticus does give a specific example of a time when God commanded certain people for a certain reason not to drink wine at all. I'm not Aaron or his sons, nor do I plan on entering the tent of meeting."

I forgot about the Nazarite vow. There are so many covenants in the Bible. Numbers is a good one.
In context :

" “Speak to the Israelites and say to them: ‘If a man or woman wants to make a special vow, a vow of dedication to the Lord as a Nazirite, 3 they must abstain from wine and other fermented drink and must not drink vinegar made from wine or other fermented drink. They must not drink grape juice or eat grapes or raisins. 4 As long as they remain under their Nazirite vow, they must not eat anything that comes from the grapevine, not even the seeds or skins."

Sounds like it's just the instructions for a biblical recommended voluntary rehab period. Do you still have no verse that says; God says no one should ever drink wine for any reason? Full stop. This seems a little pointless. Let's just say there is such a verse (not one I can find) ...the bible says we're all sinners so are we arguing that people shouldn't drink wine or that Jesus did and wasn't supposed to?

The Pentecostal sect I was raise in claimed Jesus drank grape juice. One of many things they said that really didn't sound right.

(July 31, 2020 at 9:50 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: The Pentecostal sect I was raise in claimed Jesus drank grape juice. One of many things they said that really didn't sound right.

What they were really drinking was "Virgin Kool Aid". Jim Jones did the real thing.

(July 31, 2020 at 11:36 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(July 31, 2020 at 9:50 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: The Pentecostal sect I was raise in claimed Jesus drank grape juice. One of many things they said that really didn't sound right.

What they were really drinking was "Virgin Kool Aid". Jim Jones did the real thing.

Flavoraid.

(July 31, 2020 at 11:37 am)arewethereyet Wrote:

(July 31, 2020 at 11:36 am)Brian37 Wrote: What they were really drinking was "Virgin Kool Aid". Jim Jones did the real thing.

Flavoraid.

No shit, like Hamburger Helper.

(July 31, 2020 at 11:56 am)Brian37 Wrote:

(July 31, 2020 at 11:37 am)arewethereyet Wrote: Flavoraid.

No shit, like Hamburger Helper.

I am pretty sure that Flavoraid is nothing like Hamburger Helper.

(July 31, 2020 at 9:50 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: The Pentecostal sect I was raise in claimed Jesus drank grape juice. One of many things they said that really didn't sound right.

The church I belong to teaches the same thing. The belief is most noticeable during communion. The bread is to be unleavened and the grape juice unfermented.