(March 9, 2021 at 5:00 am)Irreligious Atheist Wrote: No one denies that these people exist. That's silly. They disagree on the definition of gender or sex, and disagree that gender or sex can be changed. It's all semantics. Who cares if these people have stuck with an outdated definition of gender? Let them be ignorant. You shouldn't get to force people to use the same definition of words that you use just because outdated language makes you uncomfortable.

-and that's why people care, because those people have been trying (and succeeding) to force shitty things on other people for no reason other than their personal discomfort.  

Meanwhile, they're being told to stop being assholes, which is a bridge too far for them..and, apparently, you.  Poor put upon straight white men, victimized everywhere they go, lol.

Quote:It's not wrong to tell a boy to be a man. You should teach your son to be strong minded, so he can stand up for himself, defend himself and eventually take care of and protect his family. How are those toxic things? If the lessons don't stick and the boy ends up super sensitive and anxious or whatever, then that's fine and you accept the boy as he is, but that doesn't mean you give up from the start without at least attempting to help him become a strong minded man who won't get walked over in life.

Do you have sons? I have some. If you see a world of men getting walked over (and..ofc you do...) then how well have those lessons been working? Did their fathers not tell them to be boys often enough? Perhaps, instead..we've been teaching our sons to walk over people? Strong men, just protecting their families, by being assholes - this is exactly what the bigots insist, after all, isn't it?

Gotta be an asshole to trans people, because the nuclear family is on the line!
Gotta be an asshole to trans people, because manliness is under attack by the jewgenda!

Yes, another perspective of which I am reminded, thanks to the Nudger. Instead of insisting that boys be raised as men, how about ensuring those boys don't spend their school years being bullies. It's one thing to want your son to be a man, but it's quite another to allow him to be an intolerant ballsack.

If you tell a kid he needs to be more of something, he starts to wonder what it is he's not doing - because he has absolutely no fucking clue how to be more of what he is. Maybe, just maybe, other men might be familiar with that experience? Was it a pleasant character building one? Do we think that it accounts for the well adjusted parts of ourselves?

Say you get your ass beat, and you don't throw a punch back because it hurts you, and makes you cry, to hurt other people. Daddy comes up and castigates you. Be more of a man! How does a child satisfy that directive? Does he stuff those tears to throw punches he doesn't want to throw? Does he go nuclear manmode with a weapon? Does he, instead, throw in the towel thinking he'll never be a man on account of it being very clearly beyond his ability as implied by his father in the exhortation?

Life lessons, huh?

(March 9, 2021 at 3:06 am)Irreligious Atheist Wrote: I've seen many modern day feminists pushed by mainstream media say that the worst thing for a boys father to tell him is to be a man. A man can't explain something while being a man without being called out for sexism, or 'mansplaining'. Mainstream media couldn't even help themselves from calling even Bernie Sanders himself a sexist meanie multiple times, once for calling Warren's claim untrue, and it was implied by Joy Reid of MSNBC that Bernie is abusive for how he spoke to his wife. The most pro-woman person in the race couldn't even escape the cries of sexism and abuse of women. Every big male actor in Hollywood is put in a dress. Of course I don't have any issue with a man wanting to wear whatever and I don't have any issue with anyone being transgender, but if you pay attention, it does look like there's an agenda being pushed. The mainstream is propping up people who say their goal is the destruction of the nuclear family. Hollywood celebs are pushing the "Gender is Over" movement to merge the genders into one.

Things are getting a bit too weird out there. Drag queens with sex acts as their stage name are teaching five year olds to twerk at public libraries.

I'm cool with transgenders using whatever washroom. It's not about number of rape cases in women's shelters. You can't ask these women to think logically in the state of mind they're in or just tell them to look at the numbers. You are ignoring the comfort level and mental well being of women who may have just been beaten or raped by a man, to cater to less than one percent of the population. Is this really fair to bio women? You're going to take a woman who's just been raped and tell her to stop being irrational with her discomfort? As far as dressing rooms go, a bio woman or child shouldn't have to see a bio mans penis hanging out in front of them. With a washroom it's different because they are in a stall.

I'm all for protecting trans people, but there has been an overcorrection. A woman had to close down her business because a woman with a penis demanded a bikini wax, which the business only does for female genitalia. This trans lady wanted to force her penis on the woman who ran the business when that wasn't even a part of her business, and they had to shut down because to refuse to do so is against the law here in Canada, with our laws that are similar to what Biden just signed into law. This is an example of how laws like the one Biden signed can be abused.

I'm like 2 percent gay myself (though I identify as straight and would never want to have sex with a man) and I want non-straight and non-cis people to be who they are and feel more comfortable doing it, but 'the agenda' has gone too far. When it was gay marriage that was being fought for, the argument was "you don't have to like it, but we just want to be able to get married like you". It went from that, to now where it's "You either use the language we tell you to use, or you lose your voice and get shut out. Even if you're a doctor or an evolutionary biologist, you don't get to be a part of the debate. If you disagree with us, we're going to call that violence." So, in hindsight, I think conservatives were right that something bad was coming, but they were just wrong about what the bad thing would be.

1) When a father tells his son to be a man, there's a lot of things that entails. There's a lot of good things to being a man, and the Art of Manliness is a fairly good catalogue for that sort of thing, but the big problem is that when people say that, they're also saying "hide your emotions. Don't let them out, keep them in so that, when you're an adult, they eat at you from the inside, but when that happens, don't seek help, because that makes you less of a man. Let nobody know what's killing you until someone finds that you've coated the walls of your apartment with bits of brain." Okay, only the first sentence is actually meant, but the rest of it is a depressingly common consequence of these sorts of things.

2) Technically, "mansplaining" is supposed to refer to a specific type of explaining when men try to explain things to women that they already know like they don't already know it. Look at this Cracked page for some good examples. I don't know if your definition is that common in the wild, but if, to take an example from that Cracked page, A man is explaining rocket science to a woman and said woman isn't actually another rocket scientist who should know this, then the term should not apply.

3) Politics is vindictive, and, frankly, Warren didn't really have much to distinguish herself besides having a platform that's basically Diet Bernie and another X chromosome.

4) Every big Hollywood actor is put in a dress? So has literally every English comedian of note and it's been that way for a long time.

5) How mainstream really is gender abolitionism? Huge on some parts of Social Media=/=Mainstream.

6) How many times did the drag queen incident happen? Do you really expect 5-year-olds to understand their names? That said, twerking, especially for a 5-year-old is, to say the least, tacky.

7) It's a phobia that's fundamentally insane. Transwomen may still have penises, but they're still women, and, odds are, if they're going to a women's shelter, they've had somewhat similar experiences. Hell, this sounds like the setup for one of those scenes in movies like, well, this:



Except maybe replace Miss Daisy with a woman who's recently been raped and Hoke with a transwoman who's gone through what she's gone through. 

8) Also, where the fuck do you live where dressing rooms don't have their own stalls and everyone has to see everyone else's genitalia?

9) Some individuals may overcorrect, but society, if anything, has undercorrected.

(March 9, 2021 at 9:07 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote:

(March 9, 2021 at 5:00 am)Irreligious Atheist Wrote: No one denies that these people exist. That's silly. They disagree on the definition of gender or sex, and disagree that gender or sex can be changed. It's all semantics. Who cares if these people have stuck with an outdated definition of gender? Let them be ignorant. You shouldn't get to force people to use the same definition of words that you use just because outdated language makes you uncomfortable.

-and that's why people care, because those people have been trying (and succeeding) to force shitty things on other people for no reason other than their personal discomfort.  

Meanwhile, they're being told to stop being assholes, which is a bridge too far for them..and, apparently, you.  Poor put upon straight white men, victimized everywhere they go, lol.

Quote:It's not wrong to tell a boy to be a man. You should teach your son to be strong minded, so he can stand up for himself, defend himself and eventually take care of and protect his family. How are those toxic things? If the lessons don't stick and the boy ends up super sensitive and anxious or whatever, then that's fine and you accept the boy as he is, but that doesn't mean you give up from the start without at least attempting to help him become a strong minded man who won't get walked over in life.

Do you have sons?  I have some.  If you see a world of men getting walked over (and..ofc you do...) then how well have those lessons been working?  Did their fathers not tell them to be boys often enough?  Perhaps, instead..we've been teaching our sons to walk over people?  Strong men, just protecting their families, by being assholes - this is exactly what the bigots insist, after all, isn't it?

Gotta be an asshole to trans people, because the nuclear family is on the line!
Gotta be an asshole to trans people, because manliness is under attack by the jewgenda!

If we were going to remove people from social media for being assholes, there would be no one left.

It's not necessarily transphobic to 'deny someone's existence' as what they want to be known as. If a scientist or doctor wants to say that men can't get pregnant, I can respect that, even though I myself would say that men can get pregnant. It's all semantics and I'm not going to sit here calling doctors and scientists bigots because they are defining 'man' the way that they define it. They should not be forced to use language that they disagree with.

Telling a child to be a man to you is telling them to be an asshole. You see masculinity as equaling assholishness. I see it as teaching them to be thick skinned. If they are naturally super sensitive, then eventually you're going to have to just accept that, but that doesn't mean you give up on them being strong minded from the start. You try to point them in the right direction, and if it doesn't pan out, then so be it, but you still have to try.

If you have a young boy who identifies more with female things or female dress, this should be discouraged as well, and hopefully they grow out of it. No one should want their child to be transgender, given the suicide rate and all the problems they will face in life. You try to point them in another direction, but if the trans thing sticks long term, then you accept it and love them how they are. You still gotta try to put them in the best position to succeed in life though.

Define a successful life.

Anyone ever discourage you from being whatever the hell you are? How'd that work out?

(March 9, 2021 at 6:43 pm)no one Wrote: Define a successful life.

A life not ended by suicide is a good start. I fully accept that trans is a real thing, but for many it's a phase that they will grow out of.

So the person who is a trans needs to change because you're uncomfortable with it?

That's just science.