IYO Rev. Rye, IYO. IMO the lack of public outrage over the Timpa case, compared to the Floyd case, is due to the lack of a racism narrative to galvanise people's outrage in the Timpa case. Prove me wrong, dude, if you can, but at least acknowledge the FUNDAMENTAL connection between this Floyd case and BLM's exposure EXPLOSION in the zeitgeist.

Well, to me, the relation between BLM’s increased exposure and the George Floyd case is a bit more symbiotic than you might think. On the one hand, in the past seven years or so, BLM has done a lot to help raise consciousness against police brutality, but, for whatever reason, they were never all that popular among white people. But then The George Floyd killing happened, and it showed the world with unmistakable clarity what they were talking about all this time,

"Unmistakeable clarity" - you must be taking the piss man. There is ZERO evidence of racism in the killing of George Floyd. Shame on you for peddling such wanton and damaging lies. Shame.

(April 1, 2021 at 11:42 am)Lawz Wrote: "Unmistakeable clarity" - you must be taking the piss man. There is ZERO evidence of racism in the killing of George Floyd. Shame on you for peddling such wanton and damaging lies. Shame.

America's policing of black men has had a long history of "fear the black guy". There is no polite way to put it. Even if one is going to give that officer the benefit of the doubt, even that officer basically said, "He was a big guy, and he looked like he was on something."

I can't begin to tell you how many other times stories like this come up where the officers cop out to "I was in fear of them." Which is basically what one can read into that officer's words this time. I have heard that broken record excuse countless times over the decades. 

That officer was not in fear of Floyd. There were 4 people holding him down in the ground with Chauvin's knee on his neck for over 9 minutes. What fear should that officer have once he is in handcuffs and prone face down on the assphalt? And why the fuck didn't Chauvin or any of the officers give him CPR once he was motionless with no pulse, even when bystanders were begging Chauvin to take his knee off his neck and check his pulse? It was a good 3 minutes between his motionlessness, and when the EMT finally put him on the stretcher. Floyd was dead at that point. 

One can have a racial bias and not be racist. But as a collective society long term, there still is a great enequity in policing and how blacks and other minorities are treated in interactions vs when whites interact with them. Floyd was unfortunately yet another statistic in America not facing that inequity.

(April 1, 2021 at 11:42 am)Lawz Wrote: "Unmistakeable clarity" - you must be taking the piss man. There is ZERO evidence of racism in the killing of George Floyd. Shame on you for peddling such wanton and damaging lies. Shame.

There are race effects in American policing, though their influence doesn't seem to be a straight line. I don't know of any evidence that Chauvin was racially motivated, but I haven't looked into his history as an officer. I seem to recall that he has a history of excessive force complaints that may show a pattern related to race.

For my money, Chauvin is definitely guilty of third degree murder, but second degree is a stretch. I think he was likely doing what he usually does, and simply went too far.

Frankly, I suspect that, as long as black people remain disproportionately poor, with little opportunities to rise above the parts of town their grandparents were redlined into, and as long as there’s a strong correlation between poverty and crime, There’s not going to be much we realistically can do to stop police brutality against black people.

A cop may come into the force, truly having little to no animus against black people, but, the longer you keep going on patrol, odds are, you’re going to see a disproportionate amount of black faces, not as victims or witnesses, but perps. And the more you see of those black faces, the more you start to get this little bias. Maybe not even something you could express in words even if the rest of the force is okay with you doing so, but if you took an IAT before you joined and again years later, you’d find a lot more implicit bias against black faces. And then you might find that punishing black suspects harder comes a lot easier than you’d expect.

And all this is assuming that shit like this hasn’t been normalized on the force in general, and depressingly, in many cases, it has.

Quote:"Unmistakeable clarity" - you must be taking the piss man. There is ZERO evidence of racism in the killing of George Floyd. Shame on you for peddling such wanton and damaging lies. Shame.

American policing has racial issues period and shame on you for pushing the damaging lie it's doesn't .Shame!

(April 1, 2021 at 4:24 pm)SUNGULA Wrote:

Quote:"Unmistakeable clarity" - you must be taking the piss man. There is ZERO evidence of racism in the killing of George Floyd. Shame on you for peddling such wanton and damaging lies. Shame.

American policing has racial issues period and shame on you for pushing the damaging lie it's doesn't .Shame!

Wrong - I've never denied there're SOME racial issues in American policing.....the main one being that black looking Americans appear to commit vastly more crime per capita than other "races," and the fallout from that discrepancy. 

Let's see now, why might black looking Americans be more prone to crime....maybe because many of them're furious at "white looking America/the establishment" for slavery/segregation etc, so there's nothing many black looking Americans like more than "sticking it to the man" by enthusiastically breaking as many laws and committing as much crime as possible - makes perfect sense, doesn't it?

(April 2, 2021 at 6:02 am)Lawz Wrote:

(April 1, 2021 at 4:24 pm)SUNGULA Wrote: American policing has racial issues period and shame on you for pushing the damaging lie it's doesn't .Shame!

Wrong - I've never denied there're SOME racial issues in American policing.....the main one being that black looking Americans appear to commit vastly more crime per capita than other "races," and the fallout from that discrepancy. 

Let's see now, why might black looking Americans be more prone to crime....maybe because many of them're furious at "white looking America/the establishment" for slavery/segregation etc, so there's nothing many black looking Americans like more than "sticking it to the man" by enthusiastically breaking as many laws and committing as much crime as possible - makes perfect sense, doesn't it?

(bold mine)

Did it ever occur to you that systemic racism may be the reason for this appearance? Black people - particularly Black men - are more often targeted by cops, more likely to be convicted and given harsher sentences by courts.

Since their Supreme Court decided that 'innocence is no bar to conviction', it's been that much easier to railroad minorities into prison, whether they are guilty or not.

Boru

(April 1, 2021 at 4:00 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Frankly, I suspect that, as long as black people remain disproportionately poor, with little opportunities to rise above the parts of town their grandparents were redlined into, and as long as there’s a strong correlation between poverty and crime, There’s not going to be much we realistically can do to stop police brutality against black people.

A cop may come into the force, truly having little to no animus against black people, but, the longer you keep going on patrol, odds are, you’re going to see a disproportionate amount of black faces, not as victims or witnesses, but perps. And the more you see of those black faces, the more you start to get this little bias. Maybe not even something you could express in words even if the rest of the force is okay with you doing so, but if you took an IAT before you joined and again years later, you’d find a lot more implicit bias against black faces. And then you might find that punishing black suspects harder comes a lot easier than you’d expect.

And all this is assuming that shit like this hasn’t been normalized on the force in general, and depressingly, in many cases, it has.

It isn't that blacks have more perps than whites, but more in the fact blacks get arrested at a higher rate, and punished more severely than whites for a similar crime. But it is true that minorities on average are hurt at a higher rate by poverty than whites.