(March 18, 2022 at 10:20 pm)vulcanlogician Wrote: It's pretty obvious that the aim for "God's eternal punishment" is not justice, but control. After all, if the punishment isn't eternal, well shit. Might be worth doing... even if it means a period of discomfort in the afterlife. Not a very good way to control people. It also reveals that religion is just another way that people control people. After all, God could come down and enact his justice in front of everyone if he really wanted to drive the point home.

I remember a Christian I argued with who tried to compare hell to prison as if that alone was a justification. What he failed to account for is people can be thrown in prison for unjust reasons and prison is at least temporary (even a life sentence eventually ends)

(March 18, 2022 at 10:20 pm)vulcanlogician Wrote: It's pretty obvious that the aim for "God's eternal punishment" is not justice, but control. After all, if the punishment isn't eternal, well shit. Might be worth doing... even if it means a period of discomfort in the afterlife. Not a very good way to control people.

It is a colossal failure that it looks more like some sadist god wants to have his fun because already mentioned Hitler could easily avoid hell if he repented at the end of his life because he was a baptized Christian after all. While 1.2 billion people in India are going straight to hell no matter how "good" they are because they are polytheists who reject Jesus along with the majority of the world population, and even more if Muslims are "right".

But there is absolutely no evidence that hell exists.

If you ever watch the movie "Saved!" (with Mandy Moore), be sure to watch the extended cut; great scene on this.

(March 18, 2022 at 4:35 pm)Klorophyll Wrote:

(March 18, 2022 at 3:58 pm)Deesse23 Wrote: Thank you for admitting that you are a moral thug, that your moral compass is skewed and that you have no idea of ethics.
See it wasnt that hard. Just stop evading, stop the dishonesty and the unfair personal attacks at the questioner.

I have seen people worse than an willfully ignorant and unethical barbarian like you on these boards. I have seen people like you, but unwilling to admit what shitty people they are.

tl;dr
You are admittedly a terrible human being, but there still are worse ones around.  

What's barbarian about condemning a mass murderer or a serial killer to eternal torment ?

By just honestly asking this question, you just made my point.  
No idea about ethics, no idea about what an actual infinity (of time) means. No idea about what suffering is, let alone what eternal suffering is.

A true, uninformed, willfully ignorant barbarian.

(March 18, 2022 at 4:35 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: Hitler is responsible for the death of tens of millions of people, @Deesse23. Tell me what kind of finite punishment do you think is just?

According to you most probably infinite/eternal punishment, according to every person who has the slightest idea about ethics, who has compassion for other humans, nope.

(March 18, 2022 at 4:35 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: Let's do some math:

The value of one human life = infinity.

A murderer who takes away one human life can only get an infinitely long punishment to redress the injustice, any finite duration of emprisonment is inferior to infinity and therefore can't compensate the loss of one life.

Thank you for confirming what i said multiple times.

Ab.so.fuckingly no idea about ethics.

(March 18, 2022 at 4:35 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: There is only one way for you to defend your doomed morality: assign a finite value to human life, in which case you will be the moral thug here.

Moral thug? I am not the one parading around his boner at the thought of promoting and asking for limitless suffering on other human beings!
I am not the one stuck in an ancient barbaric system, promoting cruelty and inhumanity, like you are.

Please stop embarrassing yourself. If you just would let go of your barbaric religion, you could actually learn something, you could become less of a monster and at some time maybe something resembling a decent human being.

@kloro

If the value of one human life = infinity, then why does your god place the value of one human life at zero ?

Any murderer than can be stopped by a human could also be stopped by a god. That is if that god held any value for human life, which it doesn't.

(March 18, 2022 at 2:18 pm)Klorophyll Wrote:

(March 18, 2022 at 1:05 pm)Deesse23 Wrote: If you come across a crime scene where a rape is about to happen, what do you do?

I will try to stop it OFC.

Why?
Because you like to infringe on the free will of the rapist?

(March 15, 2022 at 2:27 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: If he were to negate injustice altogether at all times, this would jeopardize the free will of moral agents.
Allowing rape to occur is part of allowing moral agents to exercise their free will.

Please reconcile this.

(March 18, 2022 at 2:18 pm)Klorophyll Wrote: But you seem to ignore that the rapist has free will too. If God intervenes to stop one rapist, he has no reason not to stop all the other crimes that are committed, and free will obviously cannot exist anymore.

Oh, wow, the mental gymnastics here are record braking.
You claim that you would stop a rapist, but your god would and should not, and your god is the moral superior agent!?      
Why dont you try to be "better", and like your god do not stop the rapist?

As already said: Letting the rapist have some free will does not equal to allow him to rape. I am baffled to have to point this out to you.

Is that your theology? To hold your god to lesser moral standards than yourself, so you can explain away all his moral failings?  

[quote='Ferrocyanide' pid='2093965' dateline='1647729195']

Quote:this still that doesn't mean our brain will reliably lead us to anything true.

Like conclusions about the existence of gods?