(July 23, 2023 at 8:00 pm)Astreja Wrote: I'm fine with my perspective being subjective.  Everyone's perspective is subjective. 

Right. That's why moral judgments shouldn't rely on anybody's perspective, including yours.

(July 23, 2023 at 8:00 pm)Astreja Wrote: In such a case I would rather see justice not done. 

And there, we have it. You're prepared to argue for injustice just to escape your doomed argument: about finite crimes necessarily requiring finite punishment.

(July 23, 2023 at 8:00 pm)Astreja Wrote: I would not want someone brought back from the dead even if they got away with murder.  In such a case I would rather see justice not done.  The idea of someone being brought back from the dead solely for punishment is an unspeakably horrible concept, and morally primitive as well 

I knew it, arguing about morality isn't atheists' strong suit, huh?

It doesn't really matter if it's horrific, or primitive, or anything, punishment isn't supposed to be pleasant. Murder is extremely horrific in and of itself, and it's not my problem that you don't take murder seriously, and would rather, in your own words, seek justice not done. Tell that to the millions of victims of the Holocaust, of the Katyn massacre, of the My lai massacre, and of all the wonderful atrocities in history. You literally just acknowledged to all of us that you're a moral thug, your prefer Hitler and his Nazi collaborators to stay dead, rather than face retribution for what they did to these millions of people. seek justice not done.... unbelievable, I must say I didn't see that coming.

And I don't to remind you that, as an atheist, you're already walking in uncharted territory. There is no such thing as a horrific act, or a morally primitive act, if atheism is true, there simply isn't. 

(July 23, 2023 at 8:00 pm)Astreja Wrote: Let the dead stay dead, as they can no longer cause any harm.

What ?

Hitler's Mein Kampf is still an inspiring masterpiece for thousands of neo-Nazi activists. Once again, you don't really think through any of this.

Oh hey there! You given any thought to blowing guys for eternity, blissfully, cuz your girl has a fantasy? I mean, I get it, you don't think your girl thinks that...but when you think that..... I just think how sorry I am for you that there's nothing but frigid prudes where you live.

...or...maybe...you know...not that? goc goc goc goc goc......? Imagine a dick, in your mouth...forever...and then get back to us. And look, if you just cant do that, can I have your girlfriend's number?

(July 23, 2023 at 9:38 pm)Astreja Wrote: Being obsessed with justice and fairness, and an inability to take a more nuanced approach, could indicate a stalling of psychological development (e.g. stuck in Piaget's  preoperational stage, age 2-7).

An obsession with cruel punishment is something else entirely; that smacks of outright psychopathy.

more nuanced approach........??? 

Charging orthodox religious beliefs with psychopathy is a very outdated argument. Try again.

Oh, is the entirety of religion as psychopathic as you are? Fuck me...... do I even need to argue against it if that's true?

(July 24, 2023 at 2:19 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:

(July 23, 2023 at 9:38 pm)Astreja Wrote: Being obsessed with justice and fairness, and an inability to take a more nuanced approach, could indicate a stalling of psychological development (e.g. stuck in Piaget's  preoperational stage, age 2-7).

An obsession with cruel punishment is something else entirely; that smacks of outright psychopathy.

more nuanced approach........??? 

Charging orthodox religious beliefs with psychopathy is a very outdated argument. Try again.

It is a mostly accurate assessment, but because it is accurate and unanswerable you would like to pretend someone had somehow put it behind YOU,  so YOU can avoid answering and unanswerable by calling it out of date. 

It is mostly accurate because orthodox religious beliefs are not entirely psychopathic, because in All probability only some of its movers and shakers were truly psychopaths.  The rest were sociopaths.    The difference is one derives destructive psychological pathology from congenital flaw, given by god in words you can relate to, the other is given by society and upbringing.

(July 24, 2023 at 2:25 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Oh, is the entirety of religion as psychopathic as you are?

Yes, yes, Nudger. We're all psychopathic. All religions are psychopathic.

Now, what's wrong about that, exactly, if your atheism is true ? Is there some hidden rule, some hidden holy book of atheism, telling us that psychopathic belief systems are immoral or unacceptable ?

Did you forget already that Pol Pot is a fine guy in your worldview ? Did you forget that Auschwitz is neither better or worse than a poultry slaughterhouse, if your atheism is true..?

Quote:Right. That's why moral judgments shouldn't rely on anybody's perspective, including yours.

Except they all do even yours ...

Quote:And there, we have it. You're prepared to argue for injustice just to escape your doomed argument: about finite crimes necessarily requiring finite punishment.

Nope he's just not willing to engage in something deplorable and titling it justice and this in no way refutes his argument 

Quote:knew it, arguing about morality isn't atheists' strong suit, huh?

Actually this is were theists fail 

Quote:It doesn't really matter if it's horrific, or primitive, or anything, punishment isn't supposed to be pleasant. Murder is extremely horrific in and of itself, and it's not my problem that you don't take murder seriously, and would rather, in your own words, seek justice not done. Tell that to the millions of victims of the Holocaust, of the Katyn massacre, of the My lai massacre, and of all the wonderful atrocities in history. You literally just acknowledged to all of us that you're a moral thug, your prefer Hitler and his Nazi collaborators to stay dead, rather than face retribution for what they did to these millions of people. seek justice not done.... unbelievable, I must say I didn't see that coming.

Committing horrific and calling it justice avenges no one and is not justice it's simply an indulgence in base blood lust and debased savagery.

Quote:And I don't to remind you that, as an atheist, you're already walking in uncharted territory. There is no such thing as a horrific act, or a morally primitive act, if atheism is true, there simply isn't. 

Nope well charted waters and if atheism is true your idea's are no less morally repugnant or savage. It's you fumbling around in the fog lost.

Quote:What ?

Hitler's Mein Kampf is still an inspiring masterpiece for thousands of neo-Nazi activists. Once again, you don't really think through any of this

As he said Hitler isn't hurting anyone.The fact his idea's have been taken up other people who are doing harm is another matter all together. Horrifically treating Hitler would neither stop that nor will it help their victims . So no it's you who clearly hasn't thought this through as all your attempts to lambaste him as a bad person has only exposed yourself 

(July 24, 2023 at 2:31 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:

(July 24, 2023 at 2:25 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Oh, is the entirety of religion as psychopathic as you are?

Yes, yes, Nudger. We're all psychopathic. All religions are psychopathic.

Now, what's wrong about that, exactly, if your atheism is true ? Is there some hidden rule, some hidden holy book of atheism, telling us that psychopathic belief systems are immoral or unacceptable ?

Did you forget already that Pol Pot is a fine guy in your worldview ? Did you forget that Auschwitz is neither better or worse than a poultry slaughterhouse, if your atheism is true..?

Speak for yourself you filthy fucking deviant...

Did islam make you this way, or is that on you?

(July 24, 2023 at 2:31 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:

(July 24, 2023 at 2:25 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Oh, is the entirety of religion as psychopathic as you are?

Yes, yes, Nudger. We're all psychopathic. All religions are psychopathic.

Now, what's wrong about that, exactly, if your atheism is true ? Is there some hidden rule, some hidden holy book of atheism, telling us that psychopathic belief systems are immoral or acceptable ?

Did you forget already that Pol Pot is a fine guy in your worldview ? Did you forget that Auschwitz is neither better or worse than a poultry slaughterhouse, if your atheism is true..?

No, it is more likely you are a sociopath rather a psychopath.

Also, it is different when some who hold portions your belief happen to also be a psychopath or sociopath, from where you belief requires symptoms of sociopathy or psychopathy.

Quote:Yes, yes, Nudger. We're all psychopathic. All religions are psychopathic.

Now, what's wrong about that, exactly, if your atheism is true ? Is there some hidden rule, some hidden holy book of atheism, telling us that psychopathic belief systems are immoral or acceptable ?

Did you forget already that Pol Pot is a fine guy in your worldview ? Did you forget that Auschwitz is neither better or worse than a poultry slaughterhouse, if your atheism is true..?

Unlike you we don't need a magic book to tell us that shits bad and wrong. and none of your assertions above are true just apologist bullshit 

If the bible praised Pol Pot and praised Hitlers works you fuckers would be building gold statues to both and would be taking a hammer to them