Quote:No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians. 

God isn't an explanation it's a stop-gap for ignorance and again not having an explanation doesn't give credibility to theism. The fact there have been Christian scientists is irrelevant to the truth of Christianity a scientist's personal beliefs are not scientific beliefs. This a classic argument from ignorance and an appeal to authority.

(August 19, 2023 at 6:13 pm)Barry Wrote: No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians.

I wonder why there have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians?

Oh, that's right. Used to be if you were not a Christian you were tortured to death.

(August 19, 2023 at 7:09 pm)LinuxGal Wrote:

(August 19, 2023 at 6:13 pm)Barry Wrote: No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians.

I wonder why there have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians?

Oh, that's right. Used to be if you were not a Christian you were tortured to death.

Gotta love those Catholics.

"Jesus said to love everyone!"

"Yeah, but he MEANT, 'unless they are not Catholic, contradict Catholic policy, or if they're inconvenient to the current Catholic leadership. In which case, torture anf burn them. But love choirboys!'"

(August 19, 2023 at 6:13 pm)Barry Wrote: Good morning
St Augustine said that if you think you understand God, you don’t. So it’s not surprising you don’t. Nor I. But there is only one answer to the creation of the universe, and that is God. I know it’s an inconvenient answer to atheists, and agnostics, etc, and it is a real challenge for thinking theists, but that’s the answer. No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians.
So if you don’t understand, don’t worry. There are many things we don’t understand in life, but accept on faith. Faith is a gift from God. You can accept it, or reject it.
Cheers Barry

For us faithless, kindly spell out the answer. What makes you think it's so terribly binary? What makes you think these are the only two possible answers?

What makes you so afraid to admit that we may not know, that you'd adhere to a synthetic explanation totally absent of proof?

I'd argue you 1) lack the imagination to consider that the answer may still be unknown and 2) the fortitude to say "We just don't know". You insist that this is binary, but you don't say why it may only be so.

I'd argue that you in your turn don't understand science as a process.

You are essentially pushing a god-of-the-gaps argument. How's that working out for your religion? Your pope concedes that natural selection is likely true, and we've had for decades experiments and observations showing that amino acids arise naturally. We've got a hypothesis about how they might congregate into cell-like structures.

We've made good headway into reducing deaths from cancer, which seems to be beyond your god's purview.

We ship food to starving regions which your god seems to care little about.

In so many ways, the "perfect" god you worship pulls up short of human efforts, so you fall back upon, "But yeah, who made it all?" And when shown that something may arise from nothing, you shake your head. Not out of rational objection, but out of beliefs. And you're afraid to say "We don't know". No! Because you must have The Answer™ You! Your evangelism is ego writ large.

I don't care what you believe. I care what you can demonstrate.

Until then, you're just another blowhard who thinks nonbelievers will (at last!) take you seriously ... like any other blowhard.

Meanwhile, why do you still tithe to an organization which shuffles molesters off to hide them from law enforcement? Do you like supporting that stuff? Or are you simply afraid of what the Joneses will think? And if so, is that not ego as well?

(August 19, 2023 at 6:13 pm)Barry Wrote: Good morning
St Augustine said that if you think you understand God, you don’t. So it’s not surprising you don’t. Nor I. But there is only one answer to the creation of the universe, and that is God. I know it’s an inconvenient answer to atheists, and agnostics, etc, and it is a real challenge for thinking theists, but that’s the answer. No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians.
So if you don’t understand, don’t worry. There are many things we don’t understand in life, but accept on faith. Faith is a gift from God. You can accept it, or reject it.
Cheers Barry

Unfortunately for you you have no facts on your religious bias. 
We do. 

https://evolution-outreach.biomedcentral...er%20power.
"Interestingly, this difference is far more evident among distinguished scientists: Larson and Witham (https://evolution-outreach.biomedcentral...33#ref-CR6] found that 92% of the members of the National Academy of Sciences reject a belief in God or higher power."

The fact you are so uneducated that your own knowledge is limited to that possibility demonstrates nothing, but your personal ignorance and lack of education.

One cannot "accept faith: if it's totally irrational. The gullible may accept it. The rational do not accept your irrational bunk.
What did you hope to accomplish here ?
Are you so fucking stupid you think we were just waiting for you to arrive and enlighten us ?
"Pride goeth before the fall". BTW, you're a horseshit preacher.

(August 19, 2023 at 5:04 pm)Helios Wrote:

Quote:The answer for me is a God who exists outside of time.

What the heck outside of time even mean ?

Whatever the the chuckle-fuck making the claim wants it to mean.

(August 19, 2023 at 7:05 pm)Helios Wrote:

Quote:No scientist has come close to any other way explanation and there are and have been countless eminent scientists who are Christians. 

God isn't an explanation it's a stop-gap for ignorance and again not having an explanation doesn't give credibility to theism. The fact there have been Christian scientists is irrelevant to the truth of Christianity a scientist's personal beliefs are not scientific beliefs. This a classic argument from ignorance and an appeal to authority.

That's the real embarrassment.  It's not that gods aren't a good explanation, it's that gods are no explanation at all.  If I ask a meteorologist how a cloud works I'm going to get an answer to my question.  When a believer tells me a god did it, I'm still left with the initial question...how.

(August 19, 2023 at 5:15 pm)Astreja Wrote:

(August 19, 2023 at 5:04 pm)Helios Wrote: What the heck outside of time even mean ?

And how can something "outside of _________" influence something "inside ________" without becoming connected in some way to the inside?  If there were some force "outside" the known universe, if it interacted with our universe in any way I'd expect to at least see some sort of energy imbalance at the point of entry.

The chuckle-fucks who make that claim are seriously lacking in the "thinking it through" department. 

(August 19, 2023 at 6:13 pm)Barry Wrote: St Augustine said that if you think you understand God, you don’t. So it’s not surprising you don’t. Nor I.

@Barry
We can't even get a cogent description of the gawd you worship from you believers. Why would you think that we think we understand anything about your imaginary friend?!?

(August 19, 2023 at 7:25 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: In so many ways, the "perfect" god you worship pulls up short of human efforts...

"Working it's will through us" in 5... 4... 3...