(May 3, 2024 at 6:10 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote:

(May 3, 2024 at 5:46 pm)pocaracas Wrote: And yet, Ukraine is asking for more weapons, more tanks, more planes...

I knew that. Still, last time I checked, the war was at a standstill, so I can't say Russia was doing any better.

In fact, there is at least one person on this forum who said Russia is not going to win this.

Because the war has appeared to stagnate doesn’t mean both sides aren’t trying. The lines in WW1 stagnated for months at a time, while millions of rounds were expended and the bodies continued to pile up.

Boru

(May 3, 2024 at 6:23 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(May 3, 2024 at 6:10 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote: I knew that. Still, last time I checked, the war was at a standstill, so I can't say Russia was doing any better.

In fact, there is at least one person on this forum who said Russia is not going to win this.

Because the war has appeared to stagnate doesn’t mean both sides aren’t trying. The lines in WW1 stagnated for months at a time, while millions of rounds were expended and the bodies continued to pile up.

Boru

I knew that. I don’t think I said both sides weren’t trying, but a reminder like that does help.

Still, I did think they were still fighting even after an apparent stalemate, if still with effort. I mean, there has been no doubt about that.

Say, how is it going with the USA bill for aiding Ukraine that was passed by the house? I imagine the Senate must have already voted on it by now, but what’s the news on it?

Google is your friend.

(May 3, 2024 at 6:35 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote:

(May 3, 2024 at 6:23 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Because the war has appeared to stagnate doesn’t mean both sides aren’t trying. The lines in WW1 stagnated for months at a time, while millions of rounds were expended and the bodies continued to pile up.

Boru

I knew that. I don’t think I said both sides weren’t trying, but a reminder like that does help.

Still, I did think they were still fighting even after an apparent stalemate, if still with effort. I mean, there has been no doubt about that.

Say, how is it going with the USA bill for aiding Ukraine that was passed by the house? I imagine the Senate must have already voted on it by now, but what’s the news on it?

Quote:It seems to me that Russia is not trying much, if at all to win this war.

Boru

(May 3, 2024 at 7:01 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(May 3, 2024 at 6:35 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote: I knew that. I don’t think I said both sides weren’t trying, but a reminder like that does help.

Still, I did think they were still fighting even after an apparent stalemate, if still with effort. I mean, there has been no doubt about that.

Say, how is it going with the USA bill for aiding Ukraine that was passed by the house? I imagine the Senate must have already voted on it by now, but what’s the news on it?

Quote:It seems to me that Russia is not trying much, if at all to win this war.

Boru

Oops! My bad! Looks like I should have thought it over more clearly.

BUT, what I think, and I mean think, that I meant was that even if they are trying, which I am sure they are, they are not seemingly doing much with those soldiers, specifically those soldiers in what was posted before, other than sent them out to die if that "motivation" that commander apparently had made was saying anything. It is like Russia is not even thinking of their soldiers well.

I'd say that is a good way to waste men on the battlefield if you ask me; even though Russia is big as I said and has a lot of manpower, or is at least supposed to.

(May 3, 2024 at 7:08 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote: I'd say that is a good way to waste men on the battlefield if you ask me; even though Russia is big as I said and has a lot of manpower, or is at least supposed to.

Well, that's the focus of their effort: human waves, trying to overwhelm the Ukrainians, who simply do not have the numbers to fight in the same style. You see the same issue in the Korean War with Chinese mass-attacks against UN forces much smaller and more concerned about avoiding casualties, and they brought us to a standstill.

It's not like they have a lot of modern kit or a lot of talented leaders. I think even if the Russians win on the battlefield they will lose the inevitable insurgency, and this war may presage the dissolution of this version of Russian governance.

It’s Called ‘Cannon Fodder’

Quote:Kuban, a settlement in Luhansk Oblast in eastern Ukraine, is 60 miles from the front line of Russia’s 27-month wider war on Ukraine. Normally well beyond the range of most of Ukraine’s anti-personnel weapons, it had been fairly safe for its Russian occupiers.

This helps to explain why, on or just before Wednesday, potentially hundreds of Russian troops gathered out in the open in a field near Kuban—apparently for training.

The problem, for the Russians, is the Army Tactical Missile System: an American-made precision-guided ballistic missile that, depending on the model, ranges as far as 190 miles and scatters at least hundreds—at most, nearly a thousand—grenade-size submunitions.

As the Russians milled about in broad daylight on that field outside Kuban, and a Ukrainian drone observed from high overhead, four of the two-ton ATACMS streaked down. One failed to explode. The other three popped open and scattered their lethal submunitions. Each rocket turned an area as wide as 2.5 acres into a nearly inescapable kill zone.

One of the ATACMS burst directly overhead a crowd of approximately 116 unprotected Russians. All of the Russians may have died in the rain of submunitions, according to the Institute for the Study of War in Washington, D.C.

Boru

Good men have always been wasted on the battlefield.

(May 3, 2024 at 8:04 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(May 3, 2024 at 7:08 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote: I'd say that is a good way to waste men on the battlefield if you ask me; even though Russia is big as I said and has a lot of manpower, or is at least supposed to.

Well, that's the focus of their effort: human waves, trying to overwhelm the Ukrainians, who simply do not have the numbers to fight in the same style. You see the same issue in the Korean War with Chinese mass-attacks against UN forces much smaller and more concerned about avoiding casualties, and they brought us to a standstill.

It's not like they have a lot of modern kit or a lot of talented leaders. I think even if the Russians win on the battlefield they will lose the inevitable insurgency, and this war may presage the dissolution of this version of Russian governance.

Makes sense. Me, though? I would love to see how the insurgency would happen. I mean, strength in numbers to overwhelm an opponent may be good in some case, but with the loss of many Russian troops, I am not sure how they will be able to have enough of them to protect the Russian government after the war.

(May 3, 2024 at 10:02 pm)ShinyCrystals Wrote: Makes sense. Me, though? I would love to see how the insurgency would happen. I mean, strength in numbers to overwhelm an opponent may be good in some case, but with the loss of many Russian troops, I am not sure how they will be able to have enough of them to protect the Russian government after the war.

A Ukrainian insurgency will be based in the north and the west of the nation -- the north has the marshes, and the west has the mountains. There will be disruptions or attacks in cities as well. After Bucha, the Ukrainians won't surrender, though -- they know the score.

The Russian problem will be financing an occupying army for another eight or ten years while their economy withers ... kinda like the 80s, which did indeed break the Soviet regime.