Those who counsel submission have the luxury of not having to live under the ensuing Russian regime.

Talk is cheap.

(November 15, 2025 at 2:30 pm)Paleophyte Wrote: Let me put this simply: When Putin invades the USA, how many states do you plan on giving him? How many of your men will you send to their deaths then? Strange how the mathematics changes with geography.

Remember who you're asking.  The number may well be non-zero.

OFC, it's more a question of how many counties in a single state.  Ukraine is ever so slightly smaller than texas, russia has suffered over 1m casualties and who knows how many billions in equipment in order to go from having tenuous but actual control over 27% of ukraine to having nominal control over 20% of ukraine. The reason, simply put, that ukrainians are willing to negotiate over anything other than territory...is because they know russia can't actually take it. They're not concerned about the russian bear eating their lunch, they just want the terror attacks to stop. This is all academic, ofc, because it is flatly illegal for anyone in ukraine to negotiate over their territory. Zelensky couldn't give them what they want if he wanted to...and russia wouldn't accept it if it were offered.

The goal is to rub ukraine off the map, ukranian people off the land, and ukranian identity off the earth. There is no room to be accidentally ignorant on this count, as we're dealing with the most well documented conflict, in real time, in human history.

(November 15, 2025 at 2:30 pm)Paleophyte Wrote: Let me put this simply: When Putin invades the USA, how many states do you plan on giving him? How many of your men will you send to their deaths then? Strange how the mathematics changes with geography.

You think Putin wants to invade the USA? 

It's impossible for Ukraine to win back the territory it's lost through the military means it has now. Regaining the territory would require a vast escalation of violence, with more countries becoming actively involved. The people you call conservative seem reluctant to have US soldiers fighting there, or pushing a nuclear-armed country too far. 

The Americans formerly known as "Liberal" are now fully in line with the Military Industrial Complex. So they're pushing for whatever escalation they fantasize can save Ukraine. In the past the old type of liberal didn't want World War III, but that seems to have changed.

(November 15, 2025 at 8:21 am)Belacqua Wrote:

(November 15, 2025 at 7:22 am)Paleophyte Wrote: Excellent! How many states do you plan on giving to Russia?

It's not up to me.

How many men are you willing to send to their deaths? 

Certainly Friedrich Merz thinks that young Ukrainian men should stop fleeing to Germany so they can stay home and die for a pointless war. He is a traditional conservative and multi-millionaire, who has served on the board of BlackRock among other groups which profit from war. 

Quote:Following the relaxation of Ukrainian exit rules over the summer, the number of young Ukrainian men aged 18 to 22 entering Germany rose from 19 per week in mid-August to between 1,400 and 1,800 per week in October

https://www.politico.eu/article/friedric...and-fight/


Perhaps they're all going for Oktoberfest, and will report to the front lines soon. I can't imagine why they'd be reluctant to go.

Here is the web site where you can volunteer to join the Ukrainian army. It would be unfair of you to send others to die if you're not willing to go. 

https://www.ildu.com.ua/

It might be better for you to wait until they have the corruption thing under control.

Quote:In the same phone conversation, Merz also urged Zelenskyy to sort out the country’s corruption problems as Kyiv faces the fallout of a massive scandal involving kickbacks — another development that German officials fear could undermine public support for the embattled country.

Is the BBC considered more trustworthy than the Spectator?

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy8vw62j3g9o

That you consider a nations defense of their homeland a "pointless war" says everything anyone needs to know about you.

(November 15, 2025 at 6:01 pm)Belacqua Wrote: You think Putin wants to invade the USA? 

It's impossible for Ukraine to win back the territory it's lost through the military means it has now.

Key word: "now". Because victory cannot be achieved now is no reason to counsel defeatism now, as you are ding here.

(November 15, 2025 at 6:01 pm)Belacqua Wrote: The Americans formerly known as "Liberal" are now fully in line with the Military Industrial Complex. So they're pushing for whatever escalation they fantasize can save Ukraine. In the past the old type of liberal didn't want World War III, but that seems to have changed.

Not that I'm a full-on liberal, but I am not in line with the MIC. I am in line with supporting people who are fighting for their national democratic survival ... unlike you, clearly. You think they should surrender and shuffle off into the pages of history. Despicable. You should be ashamed of yourself, but you lack the thoughtfulness which shame requires.

(November 15, 2025 at 6:01 pm)Belacqua Wrote:

(November 15, 2025 at 2:30 pm)Paleophyte Wrote: Let me put this simply: When Putin invades the USA, how many states do you plan on giving him? How many of your men will you send to their deaths then? Strange how the mathematics changes with geography.

You think Putin wants to invade the USA?

No, I think that certain Muricans ought to pay for what they want with their own territory.

Quote:It's impossible for Ukraine to win back the territory it's lost through the military means it has now.

Well, I'm glad that somebody died and made you arbiter of what is possible. The term "lost" certainly suggests that all they need to do is look between their couch cushions.

Quote:The people you call conservative seem reluctant to have US soldiers fighting there, or pushing a nuclear-armed country too far.

You wouldn't know the people that I call conservatives if they kicked you in the crotch. The people that you call conservatives are nothing more than a contemptible pack of entitled cowards. It's a little hilarious to watch you regurgitate their rebranded "anti-war" bullshit as if they hadn't just rooted for Netanyahu and the extrajudicial murder of Columbians. Little men with big guns that they only dare point at smaller rivals. Since nobody's asking them to send any troops anywhere, it'd be more honest if they simply came out and admitted that it's the money that's the problem. They could all stop being a pack of hypocrites then. Well, at least on that topic. I suppose that admitting that democracy and freedom might cost something and they're uncomfortable with the bill might cut a bit close to the truth though.

Quote:The Americans formerly known as "Liberal" are now fully in line with the Military Industrial Complex.

Similarly, you wouldn't know a liberal if one kicked you in the balls. All you know are these GOP delusions.

Quote:So they're pushing for whatever escalation they fantasize can save Ukraine.

Yeah, the liberals want to escalate the war. And other pure bullshit brought to you by Fox News.

Quote:In the past the old type of liberal didn't want World War III, but that seems to have changed.

See, that isn't even a caricature of a liberal. Your rhetoric has ceased to have any bearing on reality.

Bel shows up for a troll visit. And way too many people feed him.

I don't know if you could call these people liberals. Progressives, maybe.

https://www.peaceinukraine.org

(November 15, 2025 at 9:38 pm)Belacqua Wrote: I don't know if you could call these people liberals. Progressives, maybe.

https://www.peaceinukraine.org

Their political stance doesn't matter to me. Their moral stance does.

Liberals, progressives.....conservatives..... who fucking cares? None of that matters. Russia wants what no one in ukraine can give. That's it. That's all. There's nothing else.