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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:33 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote: Dirch, two problems you need to address:
1. How do the Synoptic verses I quote work with your idea of "equality" between the deities that comprise GodCorp?
If Jesus has a subordinate will, a lesser degree of knowledge, prays on his knees to his father and acts as intercessor (ala secretary) how is he in any way "equal"?
2. If GodCorp contains three (3) deities as you've previously posted, how is that not polytheism?
Even if these three beings acted as a hive mind in perfect concert with each other, with the same will, mind and base of knowledge (which we've established is not the case), there are still three.
3 = multiple
deities = gods
multiple = poly
theism = belief in a god or in gods
Ergo: Belief in three deities = poly-theism.
Add as many "yeah but..." s as you like.
This has been asked and answered in the first 3 pages of this thread. [and several times after that] Go back and reread what was already written. If you have follow up I will be glad to address new questions.
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:45 pm
Quote:But, there is one difference between humans and divine persons of the Trinity
Indeed there is....humans actually exist.
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:47 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Thor Wrote: (June 5, 2012 at 3:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Which is all reconciled if one simply looks as the word God as a title and not a name. There isn't one deity named God. It is a title that three collectively share.
So there are three gods! Got it!
Why do you all this late in the game assume your peers are so foolish as to not address the obvious you have 'found on your own?' And do you think this thread would have been able to go 13 pages if the first person who brought this up, was not given an answer?
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:49 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Drich Wrote: This has been asked and answered in the first 3 pages of this thread. [and several times after that] Go back and reread what was already written. If you have follow up I will be glad to address new questions.
After reading page 3, you most certainly have not answered. You pushed out some nonsense and then just claim that it is a reasonable explanation when it really isn't. Oh and about you batting on about the definition of deity, after consulting many dictionaries in my house, I can say that it is simply a god or goddess. That is the most common definition I found.
I don't usually jump in on these religious discussions because it pisses me off to no end, but you were starting to annoy me. 
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:51 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:47 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do you all this late in the game assume your peers are so foolish as to not address the obvious you have 'found on your own?' And do you think this thread would have been able to go 13 pages if the first person who brought this up, was not given an answer?
An unsatisfactory answer is no answer at all.
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:51 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:47 pm)Drich Wrote: (June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Thor Wrote: So there are three gods! Got it!
Why do you all this late in the game assume your peers are so foolish as to not address the obvious you have 'found on your own?' And do you think this thread would have been able to go 13 pages if the first person who brought this up, was not given an answer?
Your answer makes no sense!
Let's see... there are three different beings who share the title of "God".... That means there must be three gods! If a country had three people who all shared the title of "President", that would mean there are three presidents.
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems?
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 3:59 pm
(This post was last modified: June 5, 2012 at 4:03 pm by Drich.)
(June 5, 2012 at 3:49 pm)frankiej Wrote: (June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Drich Wrote: This has been asked and answered in the first 3 pages of this thread. [and several times after that] Go back and reread what was already written. If you have follow up I will be glad to address new questions.
After reading page 3, you most certainly have not answered. You pushed out some nonsense and then just claim that it is a reasonable explanation when it really isn't. Oh and about you batting on about the definition of deity, after consulting many dictionaries in my house, I can say that it is simply a god or goddess. That is the most common definition I found.
I don't usually jump in on these religious discussions because it pisses me off to no end, but you were starting to annoy me.
And I am supposed to take your word that the many dictionaries you looked in, all say that Deity means an indivisual god or personage of god, and that their is no other meaning?
If so, then Perhaps you could write a strongly worded letter to the following sources explaining to them how your dictionaries at home are not consistent with what has been published here:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/deity
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition...us&q=deity
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/deity?s=t
(June 5, 2012 at 3:51 pm)Thor Wrote: (June 5, 2012 at 3:47 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do you all this late in the game assume your peers are so foolish as to not address the obvious you have 'found on your own?' And do you think this thread would have been able to go 13 pages if the first person who brought this up, was not given an answer?
Your answer makes no sense!
Let's see... there are three different beings who share the title of "God".... That means there must be three gods! If a country had three people who all shared the title of "President", that would mean there are three presidents.
Are you familiar with how the Goverment of the United States works?
There are three branches of Goverment
The Judicial (Which is the courts)
The Legislative (Which consists of the House of repersenitivies and Congress)
Then the Executive Branch (Which include the president and His staff.)
Three unique branches, with different roles, but only one Goverment of the United states.
Are we still on the same page at this point?
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 4:12 pm
(This post was last modified: June 5, 2012 at 4:22 pm by DeistPaladin.)
(June 5, 2012 at 3:39 pm)Drich Wrote: I haven't redefined anything. This is a strawman arguement centered around the fact that you are not willing to accept the dictionary's definition of Deity as posted.
Strawman argument, is it? Let's go to the tape then:
From post #4 (yours) Bold emphasis mine
Quote:In that governing body contains 3 individual deity, with three separate names/roles.
3 individual deities = 3 deities = polytheism
Quote:Also know changing what the bible says to support your arguments is also not reference material..
I've quoted directly.
Direct quotes =/= strawmen
(June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Drich Wrote: This has been asked and answered in the first 3 pages of this thread. [and several times after that] Go back and reread what was already written. If you have follow up I will be glad to address new questions.
Nope. You can claim you answered these two problems but everyone can see that you haven't.
(June 5, 2012 at 3:59 pm)Drich Wrote: Are you familiar with how the Goverment of the United States works?
There are three branches of Goverment
The Judicial (Which is the courts)
The Legislative (Which consists of the House of repersenitivies and Congress)
Then the Executive Branch (Which include the president and His staff.)
Three unique branches, with different roles, but only one Goverment of the United states.
Are we still on the same page at this point?
There are multiple politicians in our government.
There are multiple deities in your GodCorp.
Polytheism. You still haven't escaped it.
Still waiting for you to explain how Jesus is "equal" to Yahweh given the Bible verses I quoted.
By the way, Question for Dirch
Were the Romans polytheistic?
They could claim "God" is the sum total of their pantheon as you have. "God" to them is comprised of Jupiter who rules the sky, Neptune who rules the sea and Pluto who rules the underworld.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 4:45 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 3:59 pm)Drich Wrote: Are you familiar with how the Goverment of the United States works?
Very much so! I vote regularly!
Quote:There are three branches of Goverment
The Judicial (Which is the courts)
The Legislative (Which consists of the House of repersenitivies and Congress)
Then the Executive Branch (Which include the president and His staff.)
Very good. I see you passed civics class.
Quote:Three unique branches, with different roles, but only one Goverment of the United states.
Yup.
Quote:Are we still on the same page at this point?
I fail to see where you're going with this....
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems?
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RE: The trinity
June 5, 2012 at 4:51 pm
(June 5, 2012 at 4:12 pm)DeistPaladin Wrote: (June 5, 2012 at 3:39 pm)Drich Wrote: I haven't redefined anything. This is a strawman arguement centered around the fact that you are not willing to accept the dictionary's definition of Deity as posted.
Strawman argument, is it? Let's go to the tape then:
From post #4 (yours) Bold emphasis mine
Quote:In that governing body contains 3 individual deity, with three separate names/roles.
3 individual deities = 3 deities = polytheism
Quote:Also know changing what the bible says to support your arguments is also not reference material..
I've quoted directly.
Direct quotes =/= strawmen
(June 5, 2012 at 3:44 pm)Drich Wrote: This has been asked and answered in the first 3 pages of this thread. [and several times after that] Go back and reread what was already written. If you have follow up I will be glad to address new questions.
Nope. You can claim you answered these two problems but everyone can see that you haven't.
(June 5, 2012 at 3:59 pm)Drich Wrote: Are you familiar with how the Goverment of the United States works?
There are three branches of Goverment
The Judicial (Which is the courts)
The Legislative (Which consists of the House of repersenitivies and Congress)
Then the Executive Branch (Which include the president and His staff.)
Three unique branches, with different roles, but only one Goverment of the United states.
Are we still on the same page at this point?
There are multiple politicians in our government.
There are multiple deities in your GodCorp.
Polytheism. You still haven't escaped it.
Still waiting for you to explain how Jesus is "equal" to Yahweh given the Bible verses I quoted.
By the way, Question for Dirch
Were the Romans polytheistic?
They could claim "God" is the sum total of their pantheon as you have. "God" to them is comprised of Jupiter who rules the sky, Neptune who rules the sea and Pluto who rules the underworld.
Maybe you should take the time to read any one or all three defination I left for one of the other posters on this page, before you dig yourself any deeper.
Understand the word "deity" is not limited by the way you have chosen to use it.
Again I have shown my work if you wish to contest what I have said show me yours.
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