(January 4, 2013 at 6:17 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Also, it is for everyone. That's how it applies to me. The OT happened to be revealed to the Jews. We have to do our best to understand the archaic cultural references.

Unfortunately, the joke is on the Jews. The entire OT was a work of fiction according to the The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology's New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts- Israel Finkelstein, Professor of Archaeology at Tel Aviv University, and Neil Asher Silberman, a contributing editor to Archaeology Magazine.

(January 4, 2013 at 7:01 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote:

(January 4, 2013 at 6:17 am)fr0d0 Wrote: Also, it is for everyone. That's how it applies to me. The OT happened to be revealed to the Jews. We have to do our best to understand the archaic cultural references.

Unfortunately, the joke is on the Jews. The entire OT was a work of fiction according to the The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology's New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts- Israel Finkelstein, Professor of Archaeology at Tel Aviv University, and Neil Asher Silberman, a contributing editor to Archaeology Magazine.

Yes they found the first page which read.

"To my darling Cindy, The following is a work of fiction and all characters bear no relation to real persons living or dead"

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: Given that, why should anyone believe the bible is the word of a supernatural god? Why should anyone think its god exists at all?

Because of a deep seated need to believe.

(January 4, 2013 at 12:36 am)Drich Wrote:

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: Given that, why should anyone believe the bible is the word of a supernatural god? Why should anyone think its god exists at all?

Because te bible is the road map to obtain the 'proof of God" He has left for us. The bible in of itself is not proof of God, it just the instructions on how to find it.

I'm afraid you're begging the question "and why should anyone believe that the bible is the road map par excellence on the road to proving god?" Picture we're at a bazaar of the divine, packed full of booths at which adherents of various religious practices are hawking their wares. You are manning the Christian booth of your choice as I walk by. If all you have to say is "this really worked great for me and it's your loss if you don't give it a try", well, lets just say you haven't exactly separated yourself from the crowd.

(January 4, 2013 at 12:36 am)Drich Wrote:

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: Okay Christians, again only for the sake of argument, lets suppose that god does exist and the bible records an attempt on its part to communicate with mankind. How do you justify a literal reading of the bible? Perhaps a poetic reading was intended, not by the scribes, but by your god. If this god of yours is as ineffable and other worldly as is claimed, why would you think that such a being could communicate with beings as limited as ourselves in any way other than parables and poetry. You may really be missing the whole message by concretizing the poetic.

The reason we have been given "parables and poetry" in contrast to an absolute or definitive texts is so we do not worship the text itself. In otherwords so we do not worship the method of worship as the Jews did when they were give God's absolutes.

I have no problem with parables and poetry. There are perfectly reasonable Christians who read the bible as such. But online I find many more who read it the way a lawyer would and will cite you chapter and verse to back up what they frequently claim is the will of God. These Christians lose sight of their role in interpreting the bible, acting instead as though theirs is the voice of god. This is what I mean when I refer to the fundamentalist, literal interpretation.

(January 4, 2013 at 12:36 am)Drich Wrote:

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: Remember Christians, the challenge is to justify 1) that the bible is the special book and 2) that a literal interpretation is the one intended by your god .. without (for obvious reasons) citing the bible itself. I await your guidance.

Then seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit. after all it is a relationship with the Holy Spirit that the whole of the bible points to.

Sorry, no deal. You've told me nothing to tempt me to invest my time and energy in what you're selling that the others don't tell me as well. I can't (and wouldn't want to) spend my entire waking life covering all the spiritual bases so my solution is to trust my own lights. If there is a god and it wants me to know it, I am open to that. But I'm not settling for sloppy seconds. Life is pretty damn great without any gods.

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(January 4, 2013 at 9:14 am)Darwinian Wrote:

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: Given that, why should anyone believe the bible is the word of a supernatural god? Why should anyone think its god exists at all?

Because of a deep seated need to believe.

Yeah. I think of it as the allure of certainty.

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(January 4, 2013 at 2:56 am)ronedee Wrote:

(January 2, 2013 at 3:32 pm)whateverist Wrote: the challenge is to justify 1) that the bible is the special book and 2) that a literal interpretation is the one intended by your god .. without (for obvious reasons) citing the bible itself. I await your guidance.

1) It is the Word of God. Howz dat fur special?

Special perhaps, but it is the barest of assertions .. obviously no justification has been given. I assume this is your way of conceding none can.

(January 4, 2013 at 2:56 am)ronedee Wrote: 2) What other [completely definitive] work is out there that's been argued two millennium .... for, and against?

..... so, as usual the anti's making the case FOR THE WORD OF GOD!

"isn't that special!" Thank You! No Charge!!
[/quote]

Once again you haven't come close to answering the question. Or perhaps you are still answering the first question. Is English a second language for you? You strike me as highly defensive. If conversing with someone who doesn't already reinforce your belief system is so painful for you, please, don't bother.

(January 4, 2013 at 9:39 am)whateverist Wrote: Once again you haven't come close to answering the question. Or perhaps you are still answering the first question. Is English a second language for you? You strike me as highly defensive. If conversing with someone who doesn't already reinforce your belief system is so painful for you, please, don't bother.

If you ask a vague question, well you-know....!

And "no" I'm not defensive at all. Just being sarcastic.

It's continually amusing how "we" as christians have no creative freedom...yet our oppo-counterparts have free-roam in any direction they would take!

You asked what makes the bible special? Well...DUH!

Secondly (w/o using exact wording, and if I'm understanding you correctly) you asked what makes it that way w/o using bible quotes?

And I said that "it" is still being fought over and argued about after roughly 2000 years!

What other text is being fought over?! Legit question??

As an unbeliever I would expect you to use whatever means necessary to refute the Holy Bible.... as an intelligent (assumption here) person, I would expect a reply to that unique analogy.

So...I'll assume that you are indeed an "unbeliever", and choosing that route.

Quote:You asked what makes the bible special? Well...DUH!

"DUH" is not much of an answer....although I imagine it is about the most one can expect from you.

(January 4, 2013 at 4:39 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:You asked what makes the bible special? Well...DUH!

"DUH" is not much of an answer....although I imagine it is about the most one can expect from you.

I'd expect no better retort from even someone with their brain in their pants.

Can I ask what leads you to believe that the Bible is the inspired "Word of God"?

(January 4, 2013 at 4:42 pm)ronedee Wrote:

(January 4, 2013 at 4:39 pm)Minimalist Wrote: "DUH" is not much of an answer....although I imagine it is about the most one can expect from you.

I'd expect no better retort from even someone with their brain in their pants.

Odd comment from a member of Pedophilia U. How can you even pretend to be one of those slimy cocksuckers?

Well, you know what 'they' say Min: where the mind goes, the man follows.