Posts: 2658
Threads: 121
Joined: March 19, 2012
Reputation:
27
RE: how do you...
January 6, 2013 at 9:26 pm
(January 5, 2013 at 7:07 pm)apophenia Wrote: (January 5, 2013 at 1:44 pm)FallentoReason Wrote: Maybe. I'm pretty convinced that e.g. the Iliad and Odyssey were collectively written by bards and not one guy by the name of "Homer". This is because textual analysis of the Greek works reveals that it's got poetic devices that make it easier to remember the story and thus share it orally. Except, with these prophets in the Bible, there's a verse that I quote which quite explicitly says they are "prophesying" through playing their instruments. As in, that is what prophesying is about. I personally don't see anything special about it if that's the case.
Wikipedia states that this verse refers to a form of worship, and is not referring to prophesying about the future. There may be other references, I don't know.
1 Moreover David and the captains of the army separated for the service some of the sons of Asaph, of Heman, and of Jeduthun, who should prophesy with harps, stringed instruments, and cymbals. And the number of the skilled men performing their service was: 2 Of the sons of Asaph: Zaccur, Joseph, Nethaniah, and Asharelah; the sons of Asaph were under the direction of Asaph, who prophesied according to the order of the king. 3 Of Jeduthun, the sons of Jeduthun: Gedaliah, Zeri, Jeshaiah, Shimei, Hashabiah, and Mattithiah, six, under the direction of their father Jeduthun, who prophesied with a harp to give thanks and to praise the Lord.
1 Chronicles 25:1-3 (NKJV)
Oh true. It could very well be that then.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" ~ Aristotle
Posts: 686
Threads: 3
Joined: December 13, 2010
Reputation:
9
tell the difference between a false prophet and a 'genuinely' god-powered one
January 7, 2013 at 10:04 pm
Actually - the way to tell a false prophet is right in the bible - when the christ established himself as a false prophet
Deuteronomy 18:20-22
20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death.”
21 You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the Lord?” 22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.
OF course - here is ONE thing the christ said that DID NOT COME TRUE
Matthew 16:28
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.
Mark 9:1
And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power.
Luke 9:27
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God
So -= the bible itself says the christ is a False Prophet - and worse - it is the christ's supposedly OWN words that exposes him to it
Posts: 135
Threads: 2
Joined: January 7, 2013
Reputation:
1
RE: How do you tell the difference
January 8, 2013 at 12:47 am
(January 4, 2013 at 12:45 pm)Mark 13:13 Wrote: I never said its a proof but I would suggest that given the odds on its survival it is somewhat remarkable. All the survival of other religion can show that for some reason Mankind has always had a need for the spiritual. I would say beyond all reason we have an Instinctive soul awareness for God. Some may have dampened their instinct or suppressed it but it wont go away.
How can you assume that applies to each and every person in the modern world? I would be less hasty to doubt you if we were discussing this a couple thousand years ago, but in the modern world there are millions of people who never doubt that there is no deity that created this universe. It's the same explanation that I'm sure you've heard before: Religion was the only explanation in the past. That is no longer true. And many more people are starting to turn to explanations that can be proven.
I march against the Asagods
To bring the end of time.
I am pure and endless pain
And Surtr is my name.
See me rise, the mighty Surt,
Destroyer of the universe.
Bringer of flames and endless hurt
Scorcher of men and Earth.
Posts: 444
Threads: 12
Joined: December 30, 2012
Reputation:
3
RE: How do you tell the difference
January 9, 2013 at 6:38 pm
(This post was last modified: January 9, 2013 at 6:57 pm by Mark 13:13.)
(January 8, 2013 at 12:47 am)Surtr Wrote: (January 4, 2013 at 12:45 pm)Mark 13:13 Wrote: I never said its a proof but I would suggest that given the odds on its survival it is somewhat remarkable. All the survival of other religion can show that for some reason Mankind has always had a need for the spiritual. I would say beyond all reason we have an Instinctive soul awareness for God. Some may have dampened their instinct or suppressed it but it wont go away.
How can you assume that applies to each and every person in the modern world? I would be less hasty to doubt you if we were discussing this a couple thousand years ago, but in the modern world there are millions of people who never doubt that there is no deity that created this universe. It's the same explanation that I'm sure you've heard before: Religion was the only explanation in the past. That is no longer true. And many more people are starting to turn to explanations that can be proven.
absolutely true, I just find it interesting that ( i'm banned from CAF I do find I learn a lot from reading their threads) one regular rising themes when they discuss the rise in what the term "new age beliefs" is the lack of an outlet for a natural instinct for the spiritual. It would be interesting to see if we have any figures to compare which way the majority of what in political terms "floating voters" are going, Pure Atheist or into some other Theist/Pantheist/other when they decide to question their religion.
ThomM Wrote:Deuteronomy 18:20-22
20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death.”
That was the punishment for what a false prophet and yes Jesus was declared a false prophet because he declared himself to be GOD in what he said and did and yes in the eyes of unbelieving Jews this would have to be expected but as the only criteria the put to death not enough as John the Baptist was put to death ( not for religious reasons I know) but it shows that being a true prophet is no protection from execution. And there is a tradition that Jeremiah was also put to death as the jews got bored of his constant going on at them.
Quote:21 You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the Lord?” 22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.
OF course - here is ONE thing the christ said that DID NOT COME TRUE
Matthew 16:28
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.
Mark 9:1
And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power.
Luke 9:27
I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God
So -= the bible itself says the christ is a False Prophet - and worse - it is the christ's supposedly OWN words that exposes him to it
Well that depends on whether you believe Christ was saying it was to be an instant arrival aka The final End of Apocalypse or like the planting of the tiny mustard seed heralds the arrival of the great mustard tree but obviously not in a flash. So seeing Christ rising and showing the true King and the inevitable outcome of history is a display of the arrival of the kingdom. Its all a matter of interpretation and of course you have many that would take your interpretation but many more who don't.
|
