(February 6, 2013 at 11:30 pm)AtlasS Wrote: Or maybe, the greek mythology was built on Islam. Hence we believe that prophets & messengers have been there since the dawn of humanity (Adam was the first prophet).

Didn't you hear about the Greek's talk about the great flood too ? : )

Personally I believe that all mythologies were once Islam, turned slowly into heathenry, we already seen that with christianity
and now Muslims are following the same path.

We even believe that some heathen god were humans beings not mere imagination, more like saints, and with time people started to worship them & glorify them, but in most heathen religions you must find the central god or the strongest one (the father in christianity), Zeus in greek mythology, Odin ...etc.

I dunno, maybe Adm was billions of people and we're going backwards in time.
Even if Greek mythology was Islam, why would the Bible predict that myths would be introduced if we're going backwards? Why not predict the removal of myths instead?
The Greek text never specified eternity. Are you saying that the Greek myth (which you said could be Islam), was a lie? Or does anything which doesn't fall into your understanding just get brushed aside? How can you honor and respect a book if you are not even sure what it says or means?
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(February 6, 2013 at 11:47 pm)catfish Wrote:

(February 6, 2013 at 11:30 pm)AtlasS Wrote: Or maybe, the greek mythology was built on Islam. Hence we believe that prophets & messengers have been there since the dawn of humanity (Adam was the first prophet).

Didn't you hear about the Greek's talk about the great flood too ? : )

Personally I believe that all mythologies were once Islam, turned slowly into heathenry, we already seen that with christianity
and now Muslims are following the same path.

We even believe that some heathen god were humans beings not mere imagination, more like saints, and with time people started to worship them & glorify them, but in most heathen religions you must find the central god or the strongest one (the father in christianity), Zeus in greek mythology, Odin ...etc.

I dunno, maybe Adm was billions of people and we're going backwards in time.
Even if Greek mythology was Islam, why would the Bible predict that myths would be introduced if we're going backwards? Why not predict the removal of myths instead?
The Greek text never specified eternity. Are you saying that the Greek myth (which you said could be Islam), was a lie? Or does anything which doesn't fall into your understanding just get brushed aside? How can you honor and respect a book if you are not even sure what it says or means?
.

I didn't understand the line in red, could you please explain it again ?

About the rest of the comment, the origin of myths in religion is the imagining of god.
I judge any religion to be false, if it has pictures (or statues) for god. God is so divine & pure, nobody can see him or even imagine him in this life (more like a person trying to look the sun in the eye ).
If greek mythology was treating god with slight a respect, I would give it a chance, but when I see my god naked & eating his children..something is fishy. But the concept of god itself "MIGHT" be driven from an old Islamic version.
But please explain to me the red line, sorry

You claim that Greek myth "could" be Islam. From what we know about the progression of time, Greek myths came first. If you think that Islam has been around since the beginning, then why have any other religious texts, unless of course, time is progressing backwards?

If the Qu'ran is perfect and instructs the reader to honor the previous gospels, don't you think the previous gospels would be perfect too? Are there verses in the Qu'ran that instruct the reader as to which parts of the Torah and Bible are corrupted? I think that if the Qu'ran tells you to respect a corrupt work of texts, then the Qu'ran can't be perfect...
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progressing backwards... Can't believe I said that... lol

(February 7, 2013 at 12:04 am)catfish Wrote: You claim that Greek myth "could" be Islam. From what we know about the progression of time, Greek myths came first. If you think that Islam has been around since the beginning, then why have any other religious texts, unless of course, time is progressing backwards?

If the Qu'ran is perfect and instructs the reader to honor the previous gospels, don't you think the previous gospels would be perfect too? Are there verses in the Qu'ran that intruct the reader as to which parts of the Torah and Bible are corrupted? I think that if the Qu'ran tells you to respect a corrupt work of texts, then the Qu'ran can't be perfect...
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Oah yes, now I understand.

Islam is not our religion only ; it's the code of the followers of god, it was around since the coming of humans.

God never leaves a place in the world without prophets, so he sends them. Jesus christ came with Islam, moses too came with Islam.
Remember the pillars ? in all those versions of Islam ; the 6 pillars of "faith" are fixed, never to change, but the pillars of Islam do, according to the time and era (except the prayers & the Zaka).

The problem is, people start to change that religion & forge it to fit their needs, the religion is then useless ; a new prophet comes.
It was the case with Noah & Jesus. They were both sent to people who forged & forgot their original texts.
That's why most religions in the world share a basic structure making them all smilier, even if they were copycatting,how did far away nations like the mayans had the same concepts or at least similar ?

About the older gospels, we don't believe in them know, but we believe that they were sent already. We must believe that those corrupted books were once from god, and forged with time.

The Quran is special because it's the book of this time. There is no use of reviving the older books ; the Quran contains everything we need.

I mean look at the bible now, that's not the word of god, it's the word of monks, who went insane because of isolation & infinite worshiping.

And the Qu'ran has already met with it's "council" of corruption. I believe you even recognise that by your earlier words.
"Islam" as you like to call it, is written on the hearts of ALL humans. It's called your conscience and you are supposed to live your life by it, not a book.
Nobody can corrupt what's in my heart, and that is what I trust. Not some guys deciding what goes into a book. Not some printing company that can make mistakes. Not some prophet that can be misunderstood.
There is only one God and it's time that people put faith in Him, not men... (all of this is my opinion, your results may vary)
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(February 7, 2013 at 12:19 am)AtlasS Wrote: God never leaves a place in the world without prophets, so he sends them.

Aren't you leaving out the part where Mohammed was the 'last' prophet?

And... There's no way in Hades the Qu'ran can be perfect if you are making a judgement call to NOT honor the prior gospels...
This is evidence of you using your conscience to discern the truth. If you are discerning a truth that contradicts a "perfect" Qu'ran, then one of you must be wrong...
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(February 7, 2013 at 12:27 am)catfish Wrote: And the Qu'ran has already met with it's "council" of corruption. I believe you even recognise that by your earlier words.
"Islam" as you like to call it, is written on the hearts of ALL humans. It's called your conscience and you are supposed to live your life by it, not a book.
Nobody can corrupt what's in my heart, and that is what I trust. Not some guys deciding what goes into a book. Not some printing company that can make mistakes. Not some prophet that can be misunderstood.
There is only one God and it's time that people put faith in Him, not men... (all of this is my opinion, your results may vary)
.

Hmmm, I wanted to write a topic about the corruption in Islam, and how severe it is, but it's not from the Quran, it's the other books called "the Hadiths".

I can debate people with the Quran without embarrassing myself that much, but the hadiths ? oah boy, if you read most of them, you'll never talk to me again or to any other muslim, christianity is considered "sane" sometimes compared to some hadiths : )

The corruption would come from abandoning the Quran. People like me are called hypocrites & even infidels, some "fellow" muslims might behead me without hesitation, just because I follow the Quran only.

And the rest of your comment ? the most beautiful thing I ever read. It's so true.
Follow your heart, and see where that might lead you. I have said it many times in here, eventually the matter of believe is up to you only, a path that only you should take & consider.

Me & Mohammed pbuh ? we're just delivering the message. Then you would have to choose what to do with it : )

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(February 7, 2013 at 12:27 am)cato123 Wrote:

(February 7, 2013 at 12:19 am)AtlasS Wrote: God never leaves a place in the world without prophets, so he sends them.

Aren't you leaving out the part where Mohammed was the 'last' prophet?

And you're ignoring the internet what are the odds, that within the era of Islam, a tool like the internet is invented, and because of it Islam has reached everyone & every nation (except North Korea).



A lof of people wondered how the promise of god would become true, and how the Quran would reach every person..

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(February 7, 2013 at 12:35 am)catfish Wrote: And... There's no way in Hades the Qu'ran can be perfect if you are making a judgement call to NOT honor the prior gospels...
This is evidence of you using your conscience to discern the truth. If you are discerning a truth that contradicts a "perfect" Qu'ran, then one of you must be wrong...
.

Yeah I remembered the verse :

"We revealed the gospel, and we are the ones who would save it", Quran is saved without forging until the end of times, I will fetch the verse with the numbers after finding it.

That promise wasn't given to the old gospels. Humans were to take the burden of keeping them without forge.

Sura 29:46 "Dispute ye not with the people of the book, except in the best way, unless it be with those of them who do wrong but say, ‘We believe in the revelation which has come down to us and in that which came down to you; our God is your God is One; and it is to Him we submit (in Islam)."

Sura 4:150-151 "Those who deny Allah and his messengers, and wish to separate between Allah and his messengers, Saying: ‘We believe in some but reject others’: and wish to take a course midway, (151) They are in truth unbelievers;..."

Are these quotes accurate or not?
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(February 7, 2013 at 12:40 am)AtlasS Wrote: A lof of people wondered how the promise of god would become true, and how the Quran would reach every person..

Lame excuse. Joseph Smith reaches more people everyday without the use of the internet. Try again.