(March 15, 2013 at 5:11 pm)Dawud Wrote: The qurayza slaughterd themselves literally in accordance with their own law for treason.
Muhammad pbuh did not judge but it was the leader of the banu Qurayza tribe who proscribed the punishment which was in accordance with the Jewish law and not the law Muhammad pbuh came with - hence why Muhammad did not have all Jews killed (though some prejudiced atheists and evangelical Christians hope upon hope that this happened to pretend that the Muslims were anywhere near as awful as Christians). Hence why you find century upon century of Jewish and Muslim people living pecefully side by side with only exceptional cases of anything different - exceptional cases that illogical people would LOVE to pretend is the norm because they can't accept what the respected and mainstream historians tell us: Muslims and Jews had a peacefull coexistence that never happened in Cheistendom where the shameful treatment of Jews culminated in full scale genocide during the crusades)
I'm not demanding you accept the truth of Islam - but I am asking you: be honest with yourself. This picture of Muslims slaughtering Jews is only propaganda of the Christian far right who want to paint their dark side on to another people and try to play victimhood one-up-manship.
I'm not telling you you must be a Muslim but at least respect the objective and study to find out real human history. Even if Islam was false consciousness(which it is not) the image of Muslims versus Jews throughout history just doesn't stand up: we are different from Christians - even if some of us look scary and brown we do not have a history of genocide against Jews!
Let me tell you something. I was a muslim till I turned 18, I am 23 now and agnostic. I studied in the most religious school in the country. I read quran every day and prayed 5 times a week.
My family along with my twin brother are muslims now. I know what Islam is. It is the biggest fraud happened to mankind. So don't give me this crap. You're not going to fool me.
Slaughtering entire jewish tribes, taking wives as sexslaves, selling children in exchange for weapons is called a Genocide.
The Invasion of Banu Qurayza,[1] also known as the Massacre of Banu Qurayza, took place in the Dhul Qa‘dah during February and March of 627 CE (5 AH).[6]
Banu Quraysa Genocide (shortly)
The Islamic Prophet Muhammad besieged the Banu Qurayza for 25 days until they surrendered. One of Muhammad's companions decided that "the men should be killed, the property divided, and the women and children taken as captives". Muhammad approved of the ruling, calling it similar to God's judgement, after which all male members of the tribe who had reached puberty were beheaded. According to Daniel C. Peterson and Martin Lings, this judgment was in accordance with the law of Moses as stated in Deuteronomy The Muslim jurist Tabari quotes 600-900 being executed.The Sunni hadith give the number killed, and state that all males were killed and 1 woman (the 1 woman is according to Sunan Abu Dawud).The rest of the woman and children were sold in exchange for weapons and horses, according to Islamic sources.
Check your facts first then talk to me.
(March 15, 2013 at 5:11 pm)Dawud Wrote: I'm not demanding you accept the truth of Islam - but I am asking you: be honest with yourself. This picture of Muslims slaughtering Jews is only propaganda of the Christian far right who want to paint their dark side on to another people and try to play victimhood one-up-manship.
Proof From Quran
Quran-33:25- “Allah turned back the unbelievers [Meccans and their allies] in a state of rage, having not won any good, and Allah spared the believers battle. Allah is, indeed, Strong and Mighty.”
Quran-33:26- “And He brought those of the People of the Book [Jewish people of Banu Qurayza] who supported them from their fortresses and cast terror into their hearts, some of them you slew (beheaded) and some you took prisoners (captive)”
Quran-33:27- “And He made you heirs of their lands, their houses, and their goods, and of a land which ye had not frequented (before). And Allah has power over all things.” [Merciful Allah asked Prophet Muhammad to confiscate entire properties of surrendered Jews]
Quran-8:67—“It is not fitting for an Apostle that he should have prisoners of war until He thoroughly subdued the land….” (Allah insisting Prophet to kill all the prisoners, and should not keep any surrendered prisoners alive until He (Prophet) occupied entire Arabia.”
Quran-8:17—It is not ye who Slew them; it is God; when thou threwest a handful of dust, it was not Thy act, but God’s…..” (Allah said, the killing of surrendered soldiers were done by the wish of Allah)
Quran-8:69—“But (now) enjoy what ye took in war (booty), lawful and good; but fear God…” (Allah encouraging Muslims to accept booty spoils of war “Maal-E-Ganimat”)
Quran-8:1— “They ask thee concerning (things taken as) spoils of war (booty). Say: "(such) spoils are at the disposal of Allah and the Messenger: So fear Allah, and keep straight the relations between yourselves: Obey Allah and His Messenger, if ye do believe."
Quran-8:41— “And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to Allah,- and to the Messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in Allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For Allah hath power over all things.”
Proof from Hadiths
All of them:
Sahih Bukhari
Volume 1, Book 8, Number 367:
Narrated 'Abdul 'Aziz:
Anas said, 'When Allah's Apostle invaded Khaibar, we offered the Fajr prayer there yearly in the morning) when it was still dark. The Prophet rode and Abu Talha rode too and I was riding behind Abu Talha. The Prophet passed through the lane of Khaibar quickly and my knee was touching the thigh of the Prophet . He uncovered his thigh and I saw the whiteness of the thigh of the Prophet. When he entered the town, he said, 'Allahu Akbar! Khaibar is ruined. Whenever we approach near a (hostile) nation (to fight) then evil will be the morning of those who have been warned.' He repeated this thrice. The people came out for their jobs and some of them said, 'Muhammad (has come).' (Some of our companions added, "With his army.") We conquered Khaibar, took the captives, and the booty was collected. Dihya came and said, 'O Allah's Prophet! Give me a slave girl from the captives.' The Prophet said, 'Go and take any slave girl.' He took Safiya bint Huyai. A man came to the Prophet and said, 'O Allah's Apostles! You gave Safiya bint Huyai to Dihya and she is the chief mistress of the tribes of Quraiza and An-Nadir and she befits none but you.' So the Prophet said, 'Bring him along with her.' So Dihya came with her and when the Prophet saw her, he said to Dihya, 'Take any slave girl other than her from the captives.' Anas added: The Prophet then manumitted her and married her."
Thabit asked Anas, "O Abu Hamza! What did the Prophet pay her (as Mahr)?" He said, "Her self was her Mahr for he manumitted her and then married her." Anas added, "While on the way, Um Sulaim dressed her for marriage (ceremony) and at night she sent her as a bride to the Prophet . So the Prophet was a bridegroom and he said, 'Whoever has anything (food) should bring it.' He spread out a leather sheet (for the food) and some brought dates and others cooking butter. (I think he (Anas) mentioned As-SawTq). So they prepared a dish of Hais (a kind of meal). And that was Walrma (the marriage banquet) of Allah's Apostle ."
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Volume 5, Book 57, Number 66:
Narrated 'Abdullah bin Az-Zubair:
During the battle of Al-Ahzab, I and 'Umar bin Abi-Salama were kept behind with the women. Behold! I saw (my father) Az-Zubair riding his horse, going to and coming from Bani Quraiza twice or thrice. So when I came back I said, "O my father! I saw you going to and coming from Bani Quraiza?" He said, "Did you really see me, O my son?" I said, "Yes." He said, "Allah's Apostle said, 'Who will go to Bani Quraiza and bring me their news?' So I went, and when I came back, Allah's Apostle mentioned for me both his parents saying, "Let my father and mother be sacrificed for you."'
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Volume 4, Book 52, Number 68:
Narrated 'Aisha:
When Allah's Apostle returned on the day (of the battle) of Al-Khandaq (i.e. Trench), he put down his arms and took a bath. Then Gabriel whose head was covered with dust, came to him saying, "You have put down your arms! By Allah, I have not put down my arms yet." Allah's Apostle said, "Where (to go now)?" Gabriel said, "This way," pointing towards the tribe of Bani Quraiza. So Allah's Apostle went out towards them .
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Volume 4, Book 52, Number 280:
Narrated Abu Sa'id Al-Khudri:
When the tribe of Bani Quraiza was ready to accept Sad's judgment, Allah's Apostle sent for Sad who was near to him. Sad came, riding a donkey and when he came near, Allah's Apostle said (to the Ansar), "Stand up for your leader." Then Sad came and sat beside Allah's Apostle who said to him. "These people are ready to accept your judgment." Sad said, "I give the judgment that their warriors should be killed and their children and women should be taken as prisoners." The Prophet then remarked, "O Sad! You have judged amongst them with (or similar to) the judgment of the King Allah."
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Volume 4, Book 53, Number 357:
Narrated Anas bin Malik:
People used to give some of their datepalms to the Prophet (as a gift), till he conquered Bani Quraiza and Bani An-Nadir, whereupon he started returning their favors.
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Volume 5, Book 58, Number 148:
Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:
Some people (i.e. the Jews of Bani bin Quraiza) agreed to accept the verdict of Sad bin Muadh so the Prophet sent for him (i.e. Sad bin Muadh). He came riding a donkey, and when he approached the Mosque, the Prophet said, "Get up for the best amongst you." or said, "Get up for your chief." Then the Prophet said, "O Sad! These people have agreed to accept your verdict." Sad said, "I judge that their warriors should be killed and their children and women should be taken as captives." The Prophet said, "You have given a judgment similar to Allah's Judgment (or the King's judgment)."
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 362:
Narrated Ibn Umar:
Bani An-Nadir and Bani Quraiza fought (against the Prophet violating their peace treaty), so the Prophet exiled Bani An-Nadir and allowed Bani Quraiza to remain at their places (in Medina) taking nothing from them till they fought against the Prophet again) . He then killed their men and distributed their women, children and property among the Muslims, but some of them came to the Prophet and he granted them safety, and they embraced Islam. He exiled all the Jews from Medina. They were the Jews of Bani Qainuqa', the tribe of 'Abdullah bin Salam and the Jews of Bani Haritha and all the other Jews of Medina.
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 364
Narrated Anas bin Malik:
Some people used to allot some date palm trees to the Prophet as gift till he conquered Banu Quraiza and Bani An-Nadir, where upon he started returning their date palms to them.
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 443:
Narrated 'Aisha:
When the Prophet returned from Al-Khandaq (i.e. Trench) and laid down his arms and took a bath, Gabriel came and said (to the Prophet ), You have laid down your arms? By Allah, we angels have not laid them down yet. So set out for them." The Prophet said, "Where to go?" Gabriel said, "Towards this side," pointing towards Banu Quraiza. So the Prophet went out towards them.
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 444:
Narrated Anas:
As if I am just now looking at the dust rising in the street of Banu Ghanm (in Medina) because of the marching of Gabriel's regiment when Allah's Apostle set out to Banu Quraiza (to attack them).
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 445:
Narrated Ibn Umar:
On the day of Al-Ahzab (i.e. Clans) the Prophet said, "None of you Muslims) should offer the 'Asr prayer but at Banu Quraiza's place." The 'Asr prayer became due for some of them on the way. Some of those said, "We will not offer it till we reach it, the place of Banu Quraiza," while some others said, "No, we will pray at this spot, for the Prophet did not mean that for us." Later on It was mentioned to the Prophet and he did not berate any of the two groups.
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Volume 5, Book 59, Number 446:
Narrated Anas:
Some (of the Ansar) used to present date palm trees to the Prophet till Banu Quraiza and Banu An-Nadir were conquered (then he returned to the people their date palms). My people ordered me to ask the Prophet to return some or all the date palms they had given to him, but the Prophet had given those trees to Um Aiman. On that, Um Aiman came and put the garment around my neck and said, "No, by Him except Whom none has the right to be worshipped, he will not return those trees to you as he (i.e. the Prophet ) has given them to me." The Prophet go said (to her), "Return those trees and I will give you so much (instead of them)." But she kept on refusing, saying, "No, by Allah," till he gave her ten times the number of her date palms.
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Volume 8, Book 74, Number 278:
Narrated Abu Said:
The people of (the tribe of) Quraiza agreed upon to accept the verdict of Sa'd. The Prophet sent for him (Sa'd) and he came. The Prophet said (to those people), "Get up for your chief or the best among you!" Sa'd sat beside the Prophet and the Prophet said (to him), "These people have agreed to accept your verdict." Sa'd said, "So I give my judgment that their warriors should be killed and their women and children should be taken as captives." The Prophet said, "You have judged according to the King's (Allah's) judgment." (See Hadith No. 447, Vol. 5)
Sahih Muslim
Book 008, Number 3325:
Anas (Allah be pleased with him) reported that Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) set out on an expedition to Khaibar and we observed our morning prayer in early hours of the dawn. The Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) then mounted and so did Abu Talha ride, and I was seating myself behind Abu Talha. Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) moved in the narrow street of Khaibar (and we rode so close to each other in the street) that my knee touched the leg of Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him). (A part of the) lower garment of Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) slipped from his leg and I could see the whiteness of the leg of Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him). As he entered the habitation he called: Allah-o-Akbar (Allah is the Greatest). Khaibar is ruined. And when we get down in the valley of a people evil is the morning of the warned ones. He repeated it thrice. In the meanwhile the people went out for their work, and said: By Allah, Muhammad (has come). Abd al-'Aziz or some of our com- panions said: Muhammad and the army (have come). He said: We took it (the territory of Khaibar) by force, and there were gathered the prisoners of war. There came Dihya and he said: Messenger of Allah, bestow upon me a girl ont of the prisones. He said: Go and get any girl. He made a choice for Safiyya daughter of Huyayy (b. Akhtab). There came a person to Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) and said: Apostle of Allah, you have bestowed Safiyya bint Huyayy, the chief of Quraiza and al-Nadir, upon Dihya and she is worthy of you only. He said: Call him along with her. So he came along with her. When Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) saw her he said: Take any other woman from among the prisoners. He (the narrator) said: He (the Holy Prophet) then granted her emancipation and married her. Thabit said to him: Abu Hamza, how much dower did he (the Holy Prophet) give to her? He said: He granted her freedom and then married her. On the way Umm Sulaim embellished her and then sent her to him (the Holy Prophet) at night. Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) appeared as a bridegroom in the morning. He (the Holy Prophet) said: He who has anything (to eat) should bring that. Then the cloth was spread. A person came with cheese, another came with dates, and still another came with refined butter, and they prepared hais and that was the wedding feast of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him)
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Book 019, Number 4364:
It has been narrated on the authority of Ibn Umar that the Jews of Banu Nadir and Banu Quraizi fought against the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) who expelled Banu Nadir, and allowed Quraiza to stay on, and granted favour to them until they too fought against him Then he killed their men, and distributed their women, children and properties among the Muslims, except that some of them had joined the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) who granted them security. They embraced Islam. The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) turned out all the Jews of Medlina. Banu Qainuqa' (the tribe of 'Abdullah b. Salim) and the Jews of Banu Haritha and every other Jew who was in Medina.
Book 019, Number 4365:
A similar hadith has been transmitted by a different chain of narrators, but the hadith narrated by Ibn Juraij is more detailed and complete.
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Book 019, Number 4368:
It has been narrated on the authority of Abu Sa'id al-Khudri who said: The people of Quraiza surrendered accepting the decision of Sa'd b. Mu'adh about them. Accordingly, the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) sent for Sa'd who came to him riding a donkey. When he approached the mosque, the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said to the Ansar: Stand up to receive your chieftain. Then he said (to Sa'd): These people have surrendered accepting your decision. He (Sa'd) said: You will kill their fighters and capture their women and children. (Hearing this), the Propbot (may peace he tpon him) said: You have adjudged by the command of God. The narrator is reported to have said: Perhaps he said: You have adjuged by the decision of a king.
Ibn Muthanna (in his version of the tradition) has not mentioned the alternative words.
Book 019, Number 4369:
Through the same chain of transmitters Shu'ba has narrated the same tradition in which he says that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said (to Sa'd): You have adjudged according to the command of God. And once he said: you have adjudged by the decision of a king.
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Book 019, Number 4370:
It has been narrated on the authority of A'isha who said: Sa'd was wounded on the day of the Battle of the Ditch. A man from the Quraish called Ibn al-Ariqah shot at him an arrow which pierced the artery in the middle of his forearm. The Messenger of Allah (may peacce be upon him) pitched a tent for him in the mosque and would inquire after him being in close proximity. When he returned from the Ditch and laid down his arms and took a bath, the angel Gabriel appeared to him and he was removing dust from his hair (as if he had just returned from the battle). The latter said: You have laid down arms. By God, we haven't (yet) laid them down. So march against them. The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) asked: Where? He poirftad to Banu Quraiza. So the Messenger of Allah (may peace he upon him) fought against them. They surrendered at the command of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him), but he referred the decision about them to Sa'd who said: I decide about them that those of them who can fight be killed, their women and children taken prisoners and their properties distributed (among the Muslims).
Book 019, Number 4371:
It has been narrated on the authority of Hisham (who learnt it from his father) that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said (to Sa'd): You have adjudged their case with the judgment of God. the Exalted and Glorified.
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Book 019, Number 4374:
It has been narrated on the authority of Abdullah who said: On the day he returned from the Battle of Ahzab, the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) made for us an announcement that nobody would say his Zuhr prayer but in the quarters of Banu Quraiza (Some) people, being afraid that the time for prayer would expire, said their prayers before reaching the street of Banu Quraiza. The others said: We will not say our prayer except where the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) has ordered us to say it even if the time expires. (When he learned of the difference in the view of the two groups of the people, the Messenger of Allah (may peace be tipon him) did not blame anyone from the two groups.
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Book 019, Number 4376:
It has been narrated by Anas that (after his migration to Medina) a person placed at the Prophet's (may peace be upon him) disposal some date-palms growing on his land until the lands of Quraiza and Nadir were conquered. Then he began to return to him whatever he had received. (In this connection) my people told me to approach the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) and ask from him what his people had given him or a portion thereof, but the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) had bestowed those trees upon Umm Aiman. So I came to the Prophet (may peace be upon him) and he gave hem (back) to me. Umm Aiman (also) came (at this time). She put the cloth round my neck and said: No, by Allah, we will not give to, you what he has granted to me. The Holy Prophet (may peace be upon him) said: Umm Aiman, let him have them and for you are such and such trees instead. But she said: By Allah, there is no god besides Him. No, never! The Holy Prophet (may peace be upon him) continued saying: (You will get) such and such. until he had granted her ten times or nearly ten times more (than the original gift).
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Book 026, Number 5557:
Abu as-Sa'ib, the freed slaved of Hisham b. Zuhra, said that he visited Abu Sa'id Khudri in his house, (and he further) said: I found him saying his prayer, so I sat down waiting for him to finish his prayer when I heard a stir in the bundles (of wood) lying in a comer of the house. I looked towards it and found a snake. I jumped up in order to kill it, but he (Abu Sa'id Khudri) made a gesture that I should sit down. So I sat down and as he finished (the prayer) he pointed to a room in the house and said: Do you see this room? I said: Yes. He said: There was a young man amongst us who had been newly wedded. We went with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) (to participate in the Battle) of Trench when a young man in the midday used to seek permission from Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) to return to his family. One day he sought permission from him and Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) (after granting him the permission) said to him: Carry your weapons with you for I fear the tribe of Quraiza (may harm you). The man carried the weapons and then came back and found his wife standing between the two doors. He bent towards her smitten by jealousy and made a dash towards her with a spear in order to stab her. She said: Keep your spear away and enter the house until you see that which has made me come out. He entered and found a big snake coiled on the bedding. He darted with the spear and pierced it and then went out having fixed it in the house, but the snake quivered and attacked him and no one knew which of them died first, the snake or the young man. We came to Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) and made a mention to him and said: Supplicate to Allah that that (man) may be brought back to life. Thereupon he said: Ask forgiveness for your companion and then said: There are in Medina jinns who have accepted Islam, so when you see any one of them, pronounce a warning to it for three days, and if they appear before you after that, then kill it for that is a devil.
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Book 031, Number 5940:
'Abdullah b. Zubair reported on the Day of the Battle of the Trench: I and Umar b. Abu Salama were with women folk in the fort of Hassan (b. Thabit). He at one time leaned for me and I cast a glance and at anothertime I leaned for him and he would see and I recognised my father as he rode on his horse with his arms towards the tribe of Quraizah. 'Abdullah b. 'Urwa reported from Abdullah b. Zubair: I made a mention of that to my father, whereupon he said: My son, did you see me (on that occasion)? He said: Yes. Thereupon he said: By Allah, Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) addressed me saying: I would sacrifice for thee my father and my mother.
Sunan abu-Dawud
Book 14, Number 2665:
Narrated Aisha, Ummul Mu'minin:
No woman of Banu Qurayzah was killed except one. She was with me, talking and laughing on her back and belly (extremely), while the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) was killing her people with the swords. Suddenly a man called her name: Where is so-and-so? She said: I I asked: What is the matter with you? She said: I did a new act. She said: The man took her and beheaded her. She said: I will not forget that she was laughing extremely although she knew that she would be killed.
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Book 24, Number 3584:
Narrated Abdullah ibn Abbas:
When this verse was revealed: "If they do come to thee, either judge between them, or decline to interfere....If thou judge, judge in equity between them." Banu an-Nadir used to pay half blood-money if they killed any-one from Banu Qurayzah. When Banu Qurayzah killed anyone from Banu an-Nadir, they would pay full blood-money. So the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) made it equal between them.
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Book 24, Number 3631:
Narrated Tha'labah ibn AbuMalik:
Tha'labah heard his elders say that a man from the Quraysh had his share with Banu Qurayzah (in water). He brought the dispute to the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) about al-Mahzur, a stream whose water they shared together. The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) then decided that when water reached the ankles waters should not be held back to flow to the lower.
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Book 38, Number 4390:
Narrated Atiyyah al-Qurazi:
I was among the captives of Banu Qurayzah. They (the Companions) examined us, and those who had begun to grow hair (pubes) were killed, and those who had not were not killed. I was among those who had not grown hair.
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Book 39, Number 4479:
Narrated Abdullah Ibn Abbas:
Qurayzah and Nadir (were two Jewish tribes). An-Nadir were nobler than Qurayzah. When a man of Qurayzah killed a man of an-Nadir, he would be killed. But if a man of an-Nadir killed a man of Qurayzah, a hundred wasq of dates would be paid as blood-money. When Prophethood was bestowed upon the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him), a man of an-Nadir killed a man of Qurayzah.
They said: Give him to us, we shall kill him. They replied: We have the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) between you and us. So they came to him.
Thereupon the following verse was revealed: "If thou judge, judge in equity between them." "In equity" means life for a life.
The following verse was then revealed: "Do they seek of a judgment of (the days) ignorance?"
(March 9, 2013 at 2:03 pm)The Germans are coming Wrote: Honestly.
If someone in a debate thinks that replying with "The West made it up" is somehow valid, isnt worth debating with.
Especialy when muslim.
Tell me about it
