(April 20, 2013 at 6:45 am)Dawud Wrote: "Women are less than human..."

Biggest growing religion in UK amongst Women

So these women are just stupid then...

Get off your keyboard and face the world as if is you twonks! :-D

Is this a reply to me?

1. Evidence for first claim. I am ware that the ONS lists Islam as one of being growth religions both in 2001 (03) and 2011 (12/13), but the %s pale (around <5% in significance to the growing disassociation with any religion, be they major or minor:

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/census/201...igion.html

2. I was actually paraphrasing MS's comment where he indicated that women were intellectually inferior to men (posted in both this and another thread), so your last comment, if it was indeed to me, can be dismissed as a strawman as a result of not reading through the comments properly.

Actually reading the context of comments is fun!

(April 17, 2013 at 8:29 am)JustAnAtheist Wrote:

(April 17, 2013 at 5:02 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: Islam doesn't allow removing the Clitoris!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

and what about male circumcision? if Allah doesnt want us to have our foreskin he wouldve have it removed even before we were born.. clearly his 'invention' is not perfect as he claimed it is, what god is that?

your statement contradicts with the concept of right and wrong
God created us (and the world) to allow for mistakes
So he created us and ordered us to do things like circumcising and not eating pigs or removing hair, etc.
To see who obeys and who doesn't.

---

(April 18, 2013 at 12:16 pm)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote: Sorry, but ever you since you used your religion to justify why women are less than human i just find your character utterly displeasing and reprehensible. I am ashamed to be of the same species.

I didn't say that women are less, they are only different, that's why they have different responsibilities.

Are you the same as your president? why do you get less salary than him?

God created people differently that's why they are not treated the same
Islam is not about equality but about justice.

(April 20, 2013 at 8:25 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: your statement contradicts with the concept of right and wrong
God created us (and the world) to allow for mistakes
So he created us and ordered us to do things like circumcising and not eating pigs or removing hair, etc.
To see who obeys and who doesn't.

-your statement betrays your faith. Your god didn't do any of this "to see who" -it already knew who, and all by it's will anyway.

Quote:Are you the same as your president? why do you get less salary than him?

I am not the same, but we are equals. The president is subject to the same laws as I (though money and power always helps in litigation). Were you honesty unaware that the POTUS is -at the heart of it- just another citizen? What did you think happened when a president was elected, that our laws no longer applied?

Quote:God created people differently that's why they are not treated the same
Islam is not about equality but about justice.

The creation of any god has nothing to do with why people aren't treated with equality. That's a human endeavor...and if it were me, I wouldn't be so eager to pin that little bit of nastiness on my god. You, and people like you, are the reason that people are treated like sub-humans (which to my mind, puts you in the sub-human camp).

(April 20, 2013 at 8:25 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote:

(April 18, 2013 at 12:16 pm)Fidel_Castronaut Wrote: Sorry, but ever you since you used your religion to justify why women are less than human i just find your character utterly displeasing and reprehensible. I am ashamed to be of the same species.

I didn't say that women are less, they are only different, that's why they have different responsibilities.

Are you the same as your president? why do you get less salary than him?

God created people differently that's why they are not treated the same
Islam is not about equality but about justice.

This is true lunacy!

You can attempt to obfuscate what you meant when you reference yourself as saying men and women are simply different, but to anyone with a brain, reading your posts will display clearly that you, your views, and perhaps even your morals, are centuries behind the rest of us.

I could attempt, like Rhythm does in the post above this, to explain why equating equality on vocation to equality in gender is completely idiotic and is really the epitome of a false equivalence argument, but I feel the the nuances of such a point would be entirely lost on you.

When you say that a wife can be legitimately hit [quote: Sometimes a wife needs a disciplinary action], and beyond that, that people who don't believe your version of whatever god it is that you believe in [quote: then a non-follower is a criminal and should not be treated equally], you reveal your character, and that is someone that I would thoroughly not wish to associate with one iota.

Your arguments don't appeal to anything but indoctrinated reasoning that has no basis beyond your own warped worldview.

(April 20, 2013 at 8:38 am)Rhythm Wrote:

Quote:Are you the same as your president? why do you get less salary than him?

I am not the same, but we are equals. The president is subject to the same laws as I (though money and power always helps in litigation). Were you honesty unaware that the POTUS is -at the heart of it- just another citizen? What did you think happened when a president was elected, that our laws no longer applied?

It is the same, women and men are subjected to the same laws in Islam, just different responsibilities

Quote:The creation of any god has nothing to do with why people aren't treated with equality. That's a human endeavor...and if it were me, I wouldn't be so eager to pin that little bit of nastiness on my god. You, and people like you, are the reason that people are treated like sub-humans (which to my mind, puts you in the sub-human camp).

this is circular logic
People are equal because there is no God
and there is no God because people are equal

You need to think like this; if there is a God then people are not equal

(April 22, 2013 at 2:09 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: It is the same, women and men are subjected to the same laws in Islam, just different responsibilities

Not even close, try again. I appreciate that you don't feel that women are given the short end of the stick under islam - but that probably has something to do with your swinging richard - and the ability of those who swing richard to beat those who don't should they express some dissatisfaction. Now personally, I'm mystified as to why you're an advocate of beating and subjugating women - as earlier (dare I say more "enlightened") islamic cultures actually did pretty well on the notion of equality. While most of europe was counting women with the camels (if you will) the arab world was looking down their noses at it. It seems that the roles have now reversed - and that's a shame.

Quote:this is circular logic
People are equal because there is no God
and there is no God because people are equal

You need to think like this; if there is a God then people are not equal

Yes, it is, but since you're the only one offering that up I fail to see why I had to watch you embarrass yourself? Watch for the mice when you pitch that bale.

I don't "need to" think like anything, but you probably can't help yourself, you simply have to tell people what they need to think - it;s a religious imperative.

-If there is a god- full stop, there isn't
-then people are not equal - doesn't follow from your garbage premise in any case.

I you're going to play pretend, at least put a little effort into it.

(April 22, 2013 at 8:51 am)Rhythm Wrote: -If there is a god- full stop, there isn't

Can you prove that!

Quote:-then people are not equal - doesn't follow from your garbage premise in any case.

It is very simple
If Islam is true, then treating believers better than non-believer is consistent with the model
So it cannot be used against it.

It doesn't matter if Islam is true or false, the point is that you cannot use treating people UN-equally as a refutation because it is circular logic.

(April 27, 2013 at 4:05 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote:

(April 22, 2013 at 8:51 am)Rhythm Wrote: -If there is a god- full stop, there isn't

Can you prove that!

Quote:-then people are not equal - doesn't follow from your garbage premise in any case.

It is very simple
If Islam is true, then treating believers better than non-believer is consistent with the model
So it cannot be used against it.

It doesn't matter if Islam is true or false, the point is that you cannot use treating people UN-equally as a refutation because it is circular logic.

You are making the claim god is real! The burden of proof is on the person making the claim, and not the other way around.

I have been to Qatar, Saudi, and Dubai. Most of the Muslims treat others different there. I have seen expats treat poorly. It is an arrogant attitude.

(April 27, 2013 at 4:17 am)Dragonetti Wrote: You are making the claim god is real! The burden of proof is on the person making the claim, and not the other way around.

I already presented a proof
it is now your turn to refute it (if you can)

Quote:I have been to Qatar, Saudi, and Dubai. Most of the Muslims treat others different there. I have seen expats treat poorly. It is an arrogant attitude.

(Sad) Some Muslims don't follow Islam properly

Your "proof" was totally and utterly destroyed.
But you are in denial and will continue to be so.