(June 27, 2013 at 7:51 pm)pineapplebunnybounce Wrote: With drugs legalize, drug trade wouldn't just stop would it? Unless the legal parties are selling drugs for a cheaper price. Which would be hard considering we actually have to make sure we're selling proper stuff and that requires money plus tax from government to deter kids from buying it, other regulations, plus money for advertisement, etc. etc. While the illegal sellers just have to lower their price, which they can afford to do since smuggling would be a lot easier to do.

Legal drug trade would totally undercut all illegal trade run by the cartels. Have you bought very much illegally produced beer lately?

No, but I know of ppl who buy illegal cigarettes.

(June 27, 2013 at 7:51 pm)pineapplebunnybounce Wrote:

(June 27, 2013 at 7:38 pm)Polaris Wrote: Well maybe not for a couple years until the cartels run out of residual drug money from illicit trade (with drugs legalized, that drug trade falls apart), but the Mexican Drug War will likely come to an end.

With drugs legalized, drug trade wouldn't just stop would it? Unless the legal parties are selling drugs for a cheaper price. Which would be hard considering we actually have to make sure we're selling proper stuff and that requires money plus tax from government to deter kids from buying it, other regulations, plus money for advertisement, etc. etc. While the illegal sellers just have to lower their price, which they can afford to do since smuggling would be a lot easier to do.

Not to mention designer drugs.

We waste more money fighting the drug trade than anything or almost anything else. The costs associated with legalizing drug use would fail in comparison.

If drug trade is not profitable, the cartels won't engage in it...it would just be left to petty criminals.

Idk if you saw my post earlier, but i am in favour of decriminalization. The idea of legalizing drugs that are more dangerous than prescription medication and selling them like alcohol and cigarettes, and to allow easier access to it is what bothers me. I see drug addiction as a medical problem, not a criminal one. but in that sense it doesn't make sense to me to legalize something that would cause addiction and subsequent health problems. If cigarettes never got on the market (a drug today that can treat a disease but cause cancer while making you happy at the same time will not get on the market if they discovered its properties during trials), it would've been a good thing.

Things like marijuana that doesn't cause much health issues (except if you smoke it, cos particulates in the smoke cause cancer), i have no problem with, in fact with legalization it'd likely cause less health problems. should never have been illegal in the first place.

Realized I dodged your statement. Last i checked (late last year), illegal drugs are selling at very very high prices (40x or 400x their production cost, my memory sucks). Drugs can actually be produced very cheaply (especially since no money is put into health and safety regulation, paperwork, etc. etc.), so idk if they'll still make a profit, or they'll abandon the trade completely and look for something else.

If all drugs were legal, our American capitalists would refine the manufacturing process to the point that drugs would be dirt cheap. It would be uneconomical and unprofitable for the cartels to produce drugs, and all their profit, and the power that comes with it, would wither away.

I'm not saying I'm an advocate for legalizing all drugs, as I'm not sure how our society as whole would be able to handle that, but the more and more I think about it, the more I think it's the right avenue to take to deal with the problems Polaris mentioned.

my position is that i'm not sure if it will stop all the illegal drug trade, and even if it does, we're just trading one for the other. the drugs are bad for people. so we're looking at more addiction and health issues. And if the cartels are desperate they can resort to designer drugs. Which are even more dangerous and it'd just be unethical to sell to people and profit from it.

With no money to make, the cartels will away. Sure, there will be issues that will have to be dealt with by unleashing such powerful chemicals upon society, but I think with the right education, and the proper approach, any problems that result from the legalization will pale in comparison to the problems generated by the illegal drug trade.

I do find this interesting. That people are very unhappy when their medication causes side effects. Or has the possibility of side effects. When the side effects get as bad as a cigarette's, it becomes unethical for it to be approved. But when it comes to recreational drug, it's ok to sell things that are bad for people and say that it's a matter of choice and not ethics. Is there something I'm missing? i'm being sincere here, not trying to be sarcastic.

Because you're looking at it from and ideal point of view of how you would like to construct the world. Legalizing drugs is a pragmatic choice to deal with the situation at hand. It would be nice if we could stuff the cat back in the bag and make it so the illicit drugs the cartels sell suddenly become under the the control of the FDA and no one outside of the pharmaceutical companies knew how and had the resources to make drugs. The fact is, however, that criminals have the ability to make these substances and a lot of people are addicted to them. So, while decriminalization of all drugs would help relieve the stress on our prison systems, legalization would cut the head off of the snake that is responsible for the violent criminal racket that is the illegal drug trade.

Are you saying that because the "war on drug" cannot be won, we should count our losses and choose the lesser of two evils? I do realize that it's been a massive failure so far, but if they stop focusing on drug users and stop jailing drug users, more drug users may get the help they need. This would free up resources and idk, maybe help actually win the war? if this were a possibility, would you still think that drugs should be legalized? Or that maybe the government could stay on the "good" side of the situation and increase the resources and help needed by drug addicts who want to get over their addiction?

I guess what i'm saying is, are you in favour of legalizing because you believe it's the best solution atm? And supposing there's a possibility we could get rid of the cartels, would you be in favour of pursuing them or giving up and legalize?