I watched this debate between Richard Dawkins and mathematician John Lennox yesterday, and I was pretty stupefied by Mr. Lennox's ignorance. He not only thinks faith is based on evidence (that is absurd), he also says there is evidence that Jesus Christ existed. Well, after having researched it, the evidence for Christ's existence is pretty slim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKP3tMlg0II

My mom is a retired professor of Roman History (as well as Greek and Latin languages and Classical Studies) and I asked her about the Roman legal system last night. She said the Romans did in fact keep court records of the people they convicted. The paper would indicate the verdict, the defendant's name and what they had been charged with. Pontius Pilate was the judge who had supposedly sentenced Christ to be crucified, and nowhere is there a court record indicating this. There is also no arrest record of Jesus Christ anywhere in the Roman court records.

Then there is the world-famous resurrection of Jesus Christ, and the proof of this is also very slim. The Holy Bible (full of errors) only states that Christ's tomb was empty, and he appeared to Mary Magdalene. How do we know someone did not exhume him? Maybe Mary Magdalene was hallucinating when she claimed to have seen Jesus. There are no eye-witness accounts of Christ removing the covering of the tomb and climbing out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KifLDNsfOYM

Probably the best evidence for Christ's existence is from the historian Josephus, who claimed:

About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he . . . wrought surprising feats. . . . He was the Christ. When Pilate . . .condemned him to be crucified, those who had . . . come to love him did not give up their affection for him. On the third day he appeared . . . restored to life. . . . And the tribe of Christians . . . has . . . not disappeared.[i]

The problem with that: It's a secondary source by a scholar. As Jeff pointed out in the video above, there are no primary sources from anyone who was present at the time of Christ's life and crucifixion. This poses a big problem.

AronRa even claims that Christ is just a fictional character composed of previous characteristics of religious leaders from other neighboring religions. I know of no primary sources to back this up, but AronRa is a pretty brainy guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0SHlI0GyhI

Judging by the lack of primary evidence for Christ's existence, AronRa's claim sounds pretty logical.

Oh no, not another Jesus existence topic.

Well, the account by Josephus was a falsified interpolation, so we can easily rule out that bit of garbage when looking for evidence for the existence of Jesus. People will argue that the NT (full of errors) is a collection of eyewitness accounts, but if we are going to start accepting books of mythology as evidence for anything, then we also should say that Gilgamesh and Hercules existed too.

(September 16, 2013 at 7:55 pm)Michael Schubert Wrote: RE: Jesus Christ Probably Did Not Exist

That Christ never existed is as beyond debate as santa clas never existed. But whether Jesus existed is perhaps about as debatable as whether Saint Nicolas existed.

(September 16, 2013 at 7:57 pm)CleanShavenJesus Wrote: Oh no, not another Jesus existence topic.

Did you at least like the videos I posted? My favorite is the last one with AronRa.

AronRa is always great fun to watch in action. I just wish more people like him could be around to step in to simply say "no!" whilst a theist spews their bullshit as fact.

I approached AronRa some time ago inviting him to join us here at AF.org. He got back to me saying he'd love to but he's just far too busy. Nice guy; I wasn't seriously expecting him to reply at all.

(September 16, 2013 at 7:57 pm)CleanShavenJesus Wrote: Oh no, not another Jesus existence topic.

It's been at least a week. Once more unto the breach!

Quote:I was pretty stupefied by Mr. Lennox's ignorance.

What xtians think is evidence is, in general, pretty stupefying.

(September 16, 2013 at 8:09 pm)BadWriterSparty Wrote: Well, the account by Josephus was a falsified interpolation, so we can easily rule out that bit of garbage when looking for evidence for the existence of Jesus. People will argue that the NT (full of errors) is a collection of eyewitness accounts, but if we are going to start accepting books of mythology as evidence for anything, then we also should say that Gilgamesh and Hercules existed too.

As I recall, only 1 of the 2 Josephus mentions of 'the Christ' is a known, Christian interpolation.

The one mentioned above is the false account. It's even contextually wrong, if I'm not mistaken. The second one mentions the brother of Jesus, so this could be about any old Joe from that time.