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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 2:59 pm
(October 1, 2013 at 2:44 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: (September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: To believe that God exists does not require an absolute negation at all.
No one said that it does. What does that even mean?
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: It just needs positive evidence that God exists.
It doesn't even need that.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: So there is no comparison.
Neither theists nor atheists can prove God does or doesn't exist. That's a fair comparison.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: I believe the Holy Bible is true.
I like carrot cake.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: It claims to be from God Almighty.
That doesn't mean it is.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: It proves itself in many ways.
Not in any way that would prove the existence of God, apparently.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The atheists does not have a book which claims to be from their supreme being. It would say "I am God I do not exist"
This is not the way to be taken seriously. We don't believe there is a supreme being.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The Holy Bible is a record of historical events. These events show that God exist.
The Iliad being a record of historic events doesn't make its claims about the Greek gods true.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The atheist has no record of the no God''s actions.
Not believing in God does not necessarily entail believing in 'no God', and it's farcical to request a record of it.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The saved have the witness of the Holy Spirit in them.
Then the Holy Spirit is insufficient to the task of providing the saved with a good argument.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The atheists has the witness of the nobody.
Witnesses are notoriously unreliable.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The existence of the universe is a very strong proof of the existence of its Creator.
This is the fallacy of affirming the consequent.
If the universe, therefore God.
The universe.
Therefore, God.
This is equally as logical as:
If I am Bill Gates, I am rich.
I am rich.
Therefore, I am Bill Gates.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: The atheist must try to explain it away.
No need to explain away, largely, we're the ones trying to find out what actually happened. We want to know, whatever the answer is.
(September 30, 2013 at 7:37 am)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: All attempts have failed.
A good argument for not believing in God is that there are hundreds of arguments for the existence of God, and all of them are flawed. That much effort coupled with that much failure tends not to bode well. Not to mention that in real life, we don't prove things are real by arguing they are real, we prove things are real by showing the evidence for them.
Please list all of the hundreds and the refutation.
But even then an absolute negation is not proved by listing some and disproving.
You must disprove them all.
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:02 pm
(This post was last modified: October 1, 2013 at 3:04 pm by Cyberman.)
(October 1, 2013 at 2:54 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: I have a book called "Twas the Night Before Christmas." That doesn't prove anything.
It proves you have the book, which is all SBG's been able to do. Unless of course you're lying, or mistaken, or just plain wrong; all of which again makes a fair comparison to SBG.
(I so keep wanting to type that as SPG - little shout out to fans of The Young Ones, there!)
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:08 pm
SBG is one of those ultra-brainwashed Christians who seems totally impervious to reason, and when valid points are made that he can't refute, he ignores them.
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:10 pm
(October 1, 2013 at 3:08 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: SBG is one of those ultra-brainwashed Christians who seems totally impervious to reason, and when valid points are made that he can't refute, he ignores them.
So you agree that to posit an absolute negation of God requires a valid proof?
Do you have one?
P
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:15 pm
(October 1, 2013 at 3:10 pm)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: So you agree that to posit an absolute negation of God requires a valid proof?
Do you have one?
P
Do you have any proof at all for the existence of your god? And no, the bible doesn't cut it: other religions have holy books too, and you don't believe in their gods.
If the answer is no, then we are entirely justified in not believing you or your claims: the time to believe something is when you have evidence for it, not before.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:16 pm
(October 1, 2013 at 2:59 pm)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: Please list all of the hundreds and the refutation.
But even then an absolute negation is not proved by listing some and disproving.
You must disprove them all.
Please prove just one.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:21 pm
"Please list all of the hundreds and the refutation.
But even then an absolute negation is not proved by listing some and disproving.
You must disprove them all."
On the other hand - rather than us having to prove every possible argument against God why don't you prove just one.
Seems easier all the way round really.
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:23 pm
(October 1, 2013 at 3:10 pm)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: (October 1, 2013 at 3:08 pm)Doubting Thomas Wrote: SBG is one of those ultra-brainwashed Christians who seems totally impervious to reason, and when valid points are made that he can't refute, he ignores them.
So you agree that to posit an absolute negation of God requires a valid proof?
Do you have one?
P
How the hell did you get that from the words you chose to quote?
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:42 pm
(This post was last modified: October 1, 2013 at 3:42 pm by SavedByGraceThruFaith.)
(October 1, 2013 at 3:23 pm)Stimbo Wrote: (October 1, 2013 at 3:10 pm)SavedByGraceThruFaith Wrote: So you agree that to posit an absolute negation of God requires a valid proof?
Do you have one?
P
How the hell did you get that from the words you chose to quote?
Someone said I was not being logical.
It seems the atheist is not being logical.
I follow logic.
(October 1, 2013 at 3:21 pm)max-greece Wrote: "Please list all of the hundreds and the refutation.
But even then an absolute negation is not proved by listing some and disproving.
You must disprove them all."
On the other hand - rather than us having to prove every possible argument against God why don't you prove just one.
Seems easier all the way round really.
That is coming in a future post.
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RE: Atheist or really Agnostic
October 1, 2013 at 3:43 pm
I think my question still stands.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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