(April 25, 2014 at 9:55 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(April 25, 2014 at 8:50 pm)KUSA Wrote: In states that currently permit concealed carry they already have people in restaurants with guns. The point of carrying the gun is for protection against some dumb ass robbing it at gunpoint. So what does this law do to change the current situation? Nothing. You don't know what you are talking about.

Well, if enough of these laws get passed, we will see the effects. Personally, I see it like trying to solve the problem of an out of control freight train by ramming it with another out of control freight train. Sure, it might solve your problem, but you're just creating more issues. We should fight crime by stimulating the economy and making sure there are plenty of jobs, because those are proven factors in lowering the crime rate. It would do us a lot of good to fix our disastrous mental health system, too.

I'll agree with you about the economy and mental health but until the world is safe I'm gonna keep packing heat.

(April 25, 2014 at 9:55 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(April 25, 2014 at 8:50 pm)KUSA Wrote: In states that currently permit concealed carry they already have people in restaurants with guns. The point of carrying the gun is for protection against some dumb ass robbing it at gunpoint. So what does this law do to change the current situation? Nothing. You don't know what you are talking about.

Well, if enough of these laws get passed, we will see the effects. Personally, I see it like trying to solve the problem of an out of control freight train by ramming it with another out of control freight train. Sure, it might solve your problem, but you're just creating more issues. We should fight crime by stimulating the economy and making sure there are plenty of jobs, because those are proven factors in lowering the crime rate. It would do us a lot of good to fix our disastrous mental health system, too.

I would think a single state would have a large enough population to provide a reasonable sample.

Jobs don't help people. If jobs made peoples lives better we could give people spoons and have them dig a canal from the east coast to the west coast....then fill it back up lest we cause the stickle back fish to go extinct.

What makes peoples lives better is the availability of goods and services and the means for people to exchange goods and services. What improves peoples lives is production and money(since it is the tool by which we exchange goods and services). Create an environment where goods and services are readily produced and readily exchanged then you improve peoples lives.

(April 25, 2014 at 10:21 pm)Heywood Wrote: I would think a single state would have a large enough population to provide a reasonable sample.

Jobs don't help people. If jobs made peoples lives better we could give people spoons and have them dig a canal from the east coast to the west coast....then fill it back up lest we cause the stickle back fish to go extinct.

What makes peoples lives better is the availability of goods and services and the means for people to exchange goods and services. What improves peoples lives is production and money(since it is the tool by which we exchange goods and services). Create an environment where goods and services are readily produced and readily exchanged then you improve peoples lives.

Yes, and what would you call providing a good or service in exchange for money, which you admit is what improves people's lives?

A fucking job, numbnuts.

(April 25, 2014 at 10:28 pm)Faith No More Wrote:

(April 25, 2014 at 10:21 pm)Heywood Wrote: I would think a single state would have a large enough population to provide a reasonable sample.

Jobs don't help people. If jobs made peoples lives better we could give people spoons and have them dig a canal from the east coast to the west coast....then fill it back up lest we cause the stickle back fish to go extinct.

What makes peoples lives better is the availability of goods and services and the means for people to exchange goods and services. What improves peoples lives is production and money(since it is the tool by which we exchange goods and services). Create an environment where goods and services are readily produced and readily exchanged then you improve peoples lives.

Yes, and what would you call providing a good or service in exchange for money, which you admit is what improves people's lives?

A fucking job, numbnuts.

I would call exchanging a good or service for money trade. A job is a task.

Who is the numbnuts?

(April 25, 2014 at 7:53 pm)KUSA Wrote: Considering that criminals carry their guns everywhere anyway what does this bill actually hurt?

Once again with the "criminal" boogeyman, eh?

Quote:From 1993 to 2008, among homicides reported to the FBI for which the victim-offender relationship was known, between 21% and 27% of homicides were committed by strangers and between 73% and 79% were committed by offenders known to the victims.

http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=pbdetail&iid=4557

That gun is far more dangerous to you or your friends/family than any "criminal."

(April 26, 2014 at 12:14 am)Minimalist Wrote:

(April 25, 2014 at 7:53 pm)KUSA Wrote: Considering that criminals carry their guns everywhere anyway what does this bill actually hurt?

Once again with the "criminal" boogeyman, eh?

Quote:From 1993 to 2008, among homicides reported to the FBI for which the victim-offender relationship was known, between 21% and 27% of homicides were committed by strangers and between 73% and 79% were committed by offenders known to the victims.

If all the guns magically disappeared, homicides would still occur. I would imagine that 73% to 79% of all homicide offenders would still have been known by their victims.

This isn't a compelling statistic.

(April 25, 2014 at 10:06 pm)KUSA Wrote: but until the world is safe I'm gonna keep packing heat.

Gee, I'm glad I live in a country where that sort of attitude is considered quaint and archaic.

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(April 26, 2014 at 12:28 am)Heywood Wrote:

(April 26, 2014 at 12:14 am)Minimalist Wrote: Once again with the "criminal" boogeyman, eh?

If all the guns magically disappeared, homicides would still occur. I would imagine that 73% to 79% of all homicide offenders would still have been known by their victims.

This isn't a compelling statistic.

That wasn't Mins point. He was refuting the claim that the greatest danger is from criminals.

(April 26, 2014 at 12:56 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(April 25, 2014 at 10:06 pm)KUSA Wrote: but until the world is safe I'm gonna keep packing heat.

Gee, I'm glad I live in a country where that sort of attitude is considered quaint and archaic.

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(April 26, 2014 at 12:28 am)Heywood Wrote: If all the guns magically disappeared, homicides would still occur. I would imagine that 73% to 79% of all homicide offenders would still have been known by their victims.

This isn't a compelling statistic.

That wasn't Mins point. He was refuting the claim that the greatest danger is from criminals.

Except that he did a poor job at it. That you know the person isn't at all exclusive of them being a criminal. Most people who commit homicides have a prior criminal record regardless of if you know them. http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/mf.pdf Nor do I really see how this really invalidates anything. Do you not have a right to self defense because it's someone you know who is trying to kill you?

If I see a crime happening I just pray to jesus cause I know he'll protect me.

If there's one thing I can always count on, it's .... wait what? .... in a church?! ... but I thought jesus ....



Oh fuck, nevermind. Jesus Sucks!

Quote:This isn't a compelling statistic.

Not to gun nuts, I know.