(May 13, 2014 at 6:05 pm)Chas Wrote: Not assumptions, observations, for which there is plenty of evidence and no counter-examples.

Shh...pointing out what works and what doesn't ruins Chad's attempts to muddy the philosophical waters.

(May 13, 2014 at 3:39 pm)Lek Wrote: If you don't believe in him that's you're choice, but you don't need to tell him what he should be and how he should act.

It's mightily tough to argue with the insane. The insane man tells me Elvis is alive and in the room. I say "I don't see him, I don't hear him, and none of my scientific tests confirm his presence." The insane man says "Elvis doesn't want to be seen right now." I say "Elvis wanted to be seen in real life and his hiding is internally inconsistent with his known behavior."

Then the insane man tells me that "you don't need to tell Elvis how to act.."


Sound familiar?

(May 13, 2014 at 4:49 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 12:27 pm)Rampant.A.I. Wrote: Why are you seemingly incapable of absorbing the fact that many people here left religion because repentance didn't make things better?

The fact that you are an atheist means that you didn't truly repent. Sorry.

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Chad - Not an atheist. Your cursory judgement of my beliefs based on what is presented here fails utterly, and you have continued to claim to know exactly what my beliefs are, and what my specific experiences were.

I may as well assert that you were severely beaten and starved chained to the furnace in the basement as a child until you repented, ignore your objections, and repeat my assertion each time you protest.

(May 13, 2014 at 4:49 pm)ChadWooters Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 1:29 pm)Kitanetos Wrote: That indicates how little you know about real science.

Right back at you, Bud. Science has lots of assumptions: homogeneity, causal closure, that physical constants are always constant, etc.

Those are not assumptions, they are inferences, based on the best possible evidence available.

We cannot directly confirm, for example, that Pluto follows the orbit we believe it does, since not only does the planetoid have an erratic orbit, it only completes an orbit around the sun every 243 years. However, we have very reasonably inferred the orbit of Pluto, and the calculations continue to be shown accurate. This inference, by the way, relies on the physical constants you question -- which is patently fucking ridiculous as assuming physics shouldn't be uniform would eject the ability to infer basic predictions in physics that have been repeatedly demonstrated true.

Causal closure is an area of metaphysics of the mind, not even loosely related to physics, so you're reaching to even add that to a "list" that ends in "etc." What etc., you came up with two, one of which doesn't even apply.

It seems you're intent on applying metaphysics and areas of philosophy do not apply to the Applied Sciences themselves, by making these vague appeals to a "rejection" of a metaphysical supernatural realm there is no supporting evidence, nor a compelling argument, nor the possibility of demonstrating it even exists.

And then pretending physical science "rejects" or "is biased against" the existence of a realm of causes completely lacking any sort of empirical evidence, inferred or otherwise, because of some nebulous ephemeral claim backed by nothing

Sorry. You fail again. Science does not, and should not rely on presuppositions of what, for all intents and purposes, amounts to bullshit.

Science aims to discover the empirical, not make you feel better about the beliefs you hold for emotional reasons, despite empirical evidence.

...But being chained to a furnace and severely beaten for all those years as you were, I can see the difficulty in giving up your fantastic coping mechanisms.

(May 13, 2014 at 5:40 pm)Brakeman Wrote: kidding aside, The prophets and the bible authors could not have had the same method of communication as you, through scripture only, so where does the bible explain that your prayers will be different and that god won't talk to you as he did in all the other examples?

He can communicate with me any way he wants. I believe he's communicated with me through situations or signs. He might talk to me in words some day. I don't know. I don't particularly need him to do so. What are you getting at?

(May 13, 2014 at 7:08 pm)Lek Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 5:40 pm)Brakeman Wrote: kidding aside, The prophets and the bible authors could not have had the same method of communication as you, through scripture only, so where does the bible explain that your prayers will be different and that god won't talk to you as he did in all the other examples?

He can communicate with me any way he wants. I believe he's communicated with me through situations or signs. He might talk to me in words some day. I don't know. I don't particularly need him to do so. What are you getting at?

In other words, the almighty whatnot does not communicate with you at all, you are just attributing situations and signs to it that could just as well be attributed to Bugs Bunny "communicating" with you.

And if there really is a cosmic thing-a-ma-jig why would it choose to communicate by the worst, most unreliable, and useless form of communication ever devised? Is your boundless being a complete blithering idiot?

(April 16, 2014 at 8:08 pm)professor Wrote: Brakeman, I wouldn't make any determinations based on a cartoon.
Especially one that is wrong.

Given what support?

Your beliefs basically state the idea that all we exist for is to "pass the butter" to God for eternity.

(May 13, 2014 at 1:29 pm)Kitanetos Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 12:51 pm)Godschild Wrote: today's science assumes things without evidence

That indicates how little you know about real science.

Apparently more than you do.

GC

(May 13, 2014 at 7:08 pm)Lek Wrote: He can communicate with me any way he wants. I believe he's communicated with me through situations or signs. He might talk to me in words some day. I don't know. I don't particularly need him to do so. What are you getting at?

That there is no way to distinguish between your beliefs and a delusional detachment from reality.

(May 13, 2014 at 7:51 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 1:29 pm)Kitanetos Wrote: That indicates how little you know about real science.

Apparently more than you do.

GC

Apparently? Please show us that which is so apparent.

(May 13, 2014 at 7:08 pm)Lek Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 5:40 pm)Brakeman Wrote: kidding aside, The prophets and the bible authors could not have had the same method of communication as you, through scripture only, so where does the bible explain that your prayers will be different and that god won't talk to you as he did in all the other examples?

He can communicate with me any way he wants. I believe he's communicated with me through situations or signs. He might talk to me in words some day. I don't know. I don't particularly need him to do so. What are you getting at?

The bible is the whole "kit and kaboodle" message from god wherein man's relationship to god is exemplified and explained, Nowhere in the bible does the scriptures describe the type of communication with god that 99% of christians claim to be their reliable communication link by prayer, consisting of "warm fuzzy feelings," vague unrepeatable signs, and emotional awe.
Why does the bible describe religious conversations with god in one manner but todays christians only talk to him in a different "coded" manner?

Why has your mysteriously hidden god chosen to be mute now as well?

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(May 13, 2014 at 7:51 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(May 13, 2014 at 1:29 pm)Kitanetos Wrote: That indicates how little you know about real science.

Apparently more than you do.

GC

Remember, lying makes baby jesus cry...

Your claim of science competency surely gives baby jesus the fiery hot runs!