(May 26, 2014 at 11:38 pm)Beccs Wrote: But will it survive on its own?

No.

Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

I was wondering, Heywood, how would you feel if all "abortions" were medically induced labors? Would that be acceptable? In a lot of countries women who cannot afford to have abortions or cannot legally have an abortion take cytotec to induce labor. Is that okay for you?

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(May 26, 2014 at 11:51 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:38 pm)Beccs Wrote: But will it survive on its own?

No.

Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

Not being able to survive on your own is not the same thing as not being able to survive if someone cuts you open and starts removing shit from your body that you need.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:48 pm)Losty Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:33 pm)Heywood Wrote: Embryos have a cellular body that contains organelles that work together to carry on the various processes of life.

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Well you will die too if the beneficial bacteria are removed from your gut. You are not viable as an individual.

But really...embryos do engage in cellular homeostasis. Embryos meet the text book definitions of organisms.

I'm not talking about removing anything from myself or a fetus' body. No amount of love, breast milk and diaper changing will keep a fetus alive if it is not hooked up to an independent life form (a human being). It cannot engage in homeostasis on its own.
A fetus is a non-sentient living being with human DNA. It cannot think or feel, and it is not aware of its own existence.

Is it okay to shoot someone who is hooked up to a heart/lung machine? Those people aren't viable either.

Viability as a rationale for deciding which human beings can be killed and which can't is silly.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:51 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:38 pm)Beccs Wrote: But will it survive on its own?

No.

Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

THat's also a dodge, and, once again, moving the goalposts of the argument.

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(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:48 pm)Losty Wrote: I'm not talking about removing anything from myself or a fetus' body. No amount of love, breast milk and diaper changing will keep a fetus alive if it is not hooked up to an independent life form (a human being). It cannot engage in homeostasis on its own.
A fetus is a non-sentient living being with human DNA. It cannot think or feel, and it is not aware of its own existence.

Is it okay to shoot someone who is hooked up to a heart/lung machine? Those people aren't viable either.

Viability as a rationale for deciding which human beings can be killed and which can't is silly.

Once again you appeal to emotion by calling a fetus a human being.

It's a POTENTIAL human.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:48 pm)Losty Wrote: I'm not talking about removing anything from myself or a fetus' body. No amount of love, breast milk and diaper changing will keep a fetus alive if it is not hooked up to an independent life form (a human being). It cannot engage in homeostasis on its own.
A fetus is a non-sentient living being with human DNA. It cannot think or feel, and it is not aware of its own existence.

Is it okay to shoot someone who is hooked up to a heart/lung machine? Those people aren't viable either.

Viability as a rationale for deciding which human beings can be killed and which can't is silly.

You can create a new thread about whether or not it is morally right to shoot a person hooked up to a heart/lung machine if you want. That is not the topic of this discussion.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Beccs Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:51 pm)Heywood Wrote: Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

THat's also a dodge, and, once again, moving the goalposts of the argument.

No..No..No...its not a dodge. You brought up the viability angle and I demolished it. Viability as a rationale is nonsense.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:51 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:38 pm)Beccs Wrote: But will it survive on its own?

No.

Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

Seriously, that is one of your most desperate answers ever.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Beccs Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:51 pm)Heywood Wrote: Nice dodge.

But you can't survive on your own either Beccs. If all the beneficial bacteria were removed from your gut you would die. Does the fact that you are not a viable individual make it okay to kill you?

THat's also a dodge, and, once again, moving the goalposts of the argument.

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(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Heywood Wrote: Is it okay to shoot someone who is hooked up to a heart/lung machine? Those people aren't viable either.

Viability as a rationale for deciding which human beings can be killed and which can't is silly.

Once again you appeal to emotion by calling a fetus a human being.

It's a POTENTIAL human.

An embryo is a living organism or being that is human. Go back to your medical texts and look up the life cycle of a human being. We shouldn't be debating this as it is obvious.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:48 pm)Losty Wrote: I'm not talking about removing anything from myself or a fetus' body. No amount of love, breast milk and diaper changing will keep a fetus alive if it is not hooked up to an independent life form (a human being). It cannot engage in homeostasis on its own.
A fetus is a non-sentient living being with human DNA. It cannot think or feel, and it is not aware of its own existence.

Is it okay to shoot someone who is hooked up to a heart/lung machine? Those people aren't viable either.

Viability as a rationale for deciding which human beings can be killed and which can't is silly.

This one is even more desperate than the last. Try answering honestly.

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(May 26, 2014 at 11:58 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(May 26, 2014 at 11:55 pm)Beccs Wrote: THat's also a dodge, and, once again, moving the goalposts of the argument.

No..No..No...its not a dodge. You brought up the viability angle and I demolished it. Viability as a rationale is nonsense.

You demolished it? You are fucking delusional.

(May 26, 2014 at 11:53 pm)Losty Wrote: Not being able to survive on your own is not the same thing as not being able to survive if someone cuts you open and starts removing shit from your body that you need.

It is the same, You are dependent on other organism(s). You are not viable as an individual.