(July 11, 2014 at 6:36 pm)Rhythm Wrote:

(July 11, 2014 at 4:39 pm)Blackout Wrote: Sure we can disagree all day and say Russia's anti-gay law is baseless and stupid, however it is hypocritical to call it one of the most anti-gay-rights laws in the world since there are countries where it's illegal to be gay.

-if you can't "be gay in public" or "be gay around minors" how would they ever know? Being gay -so long as nobody knows about it, from an investigators point of view, is indistinguishable from being hetero. So yeah, it's about as anti-gay as it gets. So they don't stone queers in Russia, or whatever the fuck bigots are doing to people they don't like - good for them, glad to see they've taken the high road.

You can be gay in public, you can't propagate non-traditional relationships to minors, that's what the law says. Of course that doesn't mean society will accept you being gay, probably people would insult you in public for holding hands with a same sex partner and some would beat you up. But it's not as extreme as uganda's anti gay law

So, so long as you don't hold hands in front of a kid, it's k. You're studying law.......it surprises the shit out of me that you can't imagine all of the ways that this is legally actionable. I don't know about you, but I think it would be really swell to get brutalized and then charged with a crime.

(July 11, 2014 at 6:45 pm)Rhythm Wrote: So, so long as you don't hold hands in front of a kid, it's k. You're studying law.......it surprises the shit out of me that you can't imagine all of the ways that this is legally actionable.

Jesus did I even say it wasn't actionable? I'm just saying the issue of this law is not so severe as in states where being gay gets you in jail. It's not my fault Russian's don't like gays but I don't consider it a reason to avoid hosting the world cup there. And they also made a law banning gay parades for the next 100 years by the way, seems brave...

If you are attacked for being gay you can sue the person. Once again it's not my fault Russian's don't like gays, I can't force them to tolerate them. And I find it amusing that Russia is an anti-gay country and they are not so religious as other anti-gay countries.

It's just as bad. A law stands on it's own, and can be weighed before the first fines are collected, before the first trial.

What do you think happens if you refuse to pay the fine?

(July 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)Rhythm Wrote: It's just as bad, the penalties aren't. Compartmentalization bud.

So what's your proposal? Check out this - http://rt.com/news/russia-gay-law-myths-951/

It has a good description of how being gay in Russia is, and some situations are disturbing.

Even if there was a law protecting homosexuals, discrimination would still take place in society and gay people would continue to be prosecuted, that's something you can't change with laws.

I don't know but I guess you can go to jail for a very short time... But why would anybody break the law even if they're gay? If I was gay in Russia I'd prefer avoiding hate from society.

(July 11, 2014 at 6:55 pm)Blackout Wrote: I don't know but I guess you can go to jail for a very short time... But why would anybody break the law even if they're gay? If I was gay in Russia I'd prefer avoiding hate from society.

Your advice would be "Pretend to be straight and avoid being flamingly gay to dodge fines and jailtime"? You just can;t imagine why people would risk fines or jailtime to stand up to a bullshit law criminalizing their sexuality?

Yup, sounds legit.
Welcome to the island nation of New Rhythmia, where it's illegal to be a hetero(in public..of course). I suggest you blow somebody (or at least pretend convincingly) if you don't wan't to get into any trouble with the law. Why would anyone break the law? Wouldn't you prefer avoiding hate?

(July 11, 2014 at 6:59 pm)Rhythm Wrote:

(July 11, 2014 at 6:55 pm)Blackout Wrote: I don't know but I guess you can go to jail for a very short time... But why would anybody break the law even if they're gay? If I was gay in Russia I'd prefer avoiding hate from society.

Your advice would be "Pretend to be straight and avoid being flamingly gay to avoid fines and jailtime"

Yup, sounds legit.

My advice - Do what you prefer. But between avoiding gay behavior in public and going to jail, I think the latter is worse. If a similar law was made to atheists, I'd do the same, I wouldn't be an atheist in public but I would be at home, like gays can be in russia. How do you propose going against 80% or more of Russians that dislike or hate gays?

I'm wondering whether or not my involvement is actually causing you to make such horrid excuses, to offer such vapid counterpoints - or if you would do it all by your one-sies?

late edit: I would propose being as homosexual as possible in public - to oppose the tyranny of the masses, btw

(July 11, 2014 at 7:01 pm)Blackout Wrote: If a similar law was made to atheists, I'd do the same, I wouldn't be an atheist in public but I would be at home, like gays can be in russia.

How can you justify this? Seriously?

It's oppression, discrimination and censorship at it's finest. You may as well pass laws ensuring gays sit at the back of the bus. Out of sight and out of mind.

Stop making excuses. Stop making out like this intolerant society is so much better for gays than other intolerant societies.

(July 11, 2014 at 7:13 pm)Napoléon Wrote:

(July 11, 2014 at 7:01 pm)Blackout Wrote: If a similar law was made to atheists, I'd do the same, I wouldn't be an atheist in public but I would be at home, like gays can be in russia.

How can you justify this? Seriously?

It's oppression, discrimination and censorship at it's finest. You may as well pass laws ensuring gays sit at the back of the bus. Out of sight and out of mind.

Stop making excuses. Stop making out like this intolerant society is so much better for gays than other intolerant societies.

Firstly, I'm not justyfing anything, I'm just saying I don't understand the relationship between a country's politics and their capacity to host a sports even in the future with all the requirements Secondly, it is better to pay a fine than going to jail or facing the death penalty, anyone will understand that. And thirdly, between keeping my mouth shut and facing a 50000 fine, I'd prefer keeping my mouth shut in public, considering 80% of the population would be hostile to me, it's a reasonable and rational cost of opportunity, not to mention I could lose my life.

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(July 11, 2014 at 7:05 pm)Rhythm Wrote: I'm wondering whether or not my involvement is actually causing you to make such horrid excuses, to offer such vapid counterpoints - or if you would do it all by your one-sies?

late edit: I would propose being as homosexual as possible in public - to oppose the tyranny of the masses, btw

So you propose putting a minority in risk of death against 80% of the Russian population? So proposing something that can get them killed by anti-gay extremists is reasonable? I don't think so. My proposal is to protest against it peacefully and not by forcibly breaking the law, I don't think Russians would have a problem arresting all gay people.. And then when? Who'd fight for gay rights?

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Quote:I'm wondering whether or not my involvement is actually causing you to make such horrid excuses, to offer such vapid counterpoints - or if you would do it all by your one-sies?

A quick question out of ignorance, what does "one-sies" mean?