(September 17, 2014 at 11:35 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Mhm, "it's a miracle" is far more likely.

EDIT: Man this formatting..

As usual, you miss the point. His "explanation" was no explanation at all.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:40 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 11:35 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Mhm, "it's a miracle" is far more likely.

EDIT: Man this formatting..

As usual, you miss the point. His "explanation" was no explanation at all.

Neither is saying something is "a miracle". It discourages further investigation because you already know God did it.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:44 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 11:40 am)Huggy74 Wrote: As usual, you miss the point. His "explanation" was no explanation at all.

Neither is saying something is "a miracle". It discourages further investigation because you already know God did it.

Nope, as I showed you earlier, it simply means it's unexplained scientifically.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:51 am)Huggy74 Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 11:44 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Neither is saying something is "a miracle". It discourages further investigation because you already know God did it.

Nope, as I showed you earlier, it simply means it's unexplained scientifically.

Then your definition of miracle is useless and arbitrary, and has nothing to do with any sort of supernatural entity or force.

The papers were there to show that we can understand how the placebo effect works by studying the biochemistry of the brain and the physiology of the human body in general. Those studies apply mostly to Parkinson's disease because that's where the effect is most apparent. The reward mechanisms ARE how the placebo works: you are giving your patient an innocuous chemical which he thinks it's medicine (something good for his body). Thus, the reward mechanisms of the patient are triggered and dopamine is produced. Moreover, the biochemistry of the placebo effect in Parkinson's might help in the near future to have a better understanding of how it works in general.

It's just as if a man in the 1600s said that we could not possibly ever hope to explain lightning via physics because no one had come up with a scientific explanation since the dawn of mankind. You're just being unreasonable and impatient. I can't explain that, therefore god is one of the worst possible arguments one could ever come up with.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:52 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 11:51 am)Huggy74 Wrote: Nope, as I showed you earlier, it simply means it's unexplained scientifically.

Then your definition of miracle is useless and arbitrary, and has nothing to do with any sort of supernatural entity or force.

Which I made clear earlier in this thread by stating that "anyone can have faith, it has nothing to do with religion."

In fact, Jesus made a remark about a roman centurion. "I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel" the centurion was a roman pagan.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:59 am)oukoida Wrote: The papers were there to show that we can understand how the placebo effect works by studying the biochemistry of the brain and the physiology of the human body in general. Those studies apply mostly to Parkinson's disease because that's where the effect is most apparent. The reward mechanisms ARE how the placebo works: you are giving your patient an innocuous chemical which he thinks it's medicine (something good for his body). Thus, the reward mechanisms of the patient are triggered and dopamine is produced. Moreover, the biochemistry of the placebo effect in Parkinson's might help in the near future to have a better understanding of how it works in general.

It's just as if a man in the 1600s said that we could not possibly ever hope to explain lightning via physics because no one had come up with a scientific explanation since the dawn of mankind. You're just being unreasonable and impatient. I can't explain that, therefore god is one of the worst possible arguments one could ever come up with.

Unless of course he literally means 'miracle' as just a placeholder word for 'unkown' without reference to a deity's existence....which would make this entire conversation a waste of time.

(September 17, 2014 at 11:59 am)oukoida Wrote: The papers were there to show that we can understand how the placebo effect works by studying the biochemistry of the brain and the physiology of the human body in general. Those studies apply mostly to Parkinson's disease because that's where the effect is most apparent. The reward mechanisms ARE how the placebo works: you are giving your patient an innocuous chemical which he thinks it's medicine (something good for his body). Thus, the reward mechanisms of the patient are triggered and dopamine is produced. Moreover, the biochemistry of the placebo effect in Parkinson's might help in the near future to have a better understanding of how it works in general.

It's just as if a man in the 1600s said that we could not possibly ever hope to explain lightning via physics because no one had come up with a scientific explanation since the dawn of mankind. You're just being unreasonable and impatient. I can't explain that, therefore god is one of the worst possible arguments one could ever come up with.

Then find a study on how dopamine affects cancer...I'll wait.

(September 17, 2014 at 12:05 pm)Huggy74 Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 11:59 am)oukoida Wrote: The papers were there to show that we can understand how the placebo effect works by studying the biochemistry of the brain and the physiology of the human body in general. Those studies apply mostly to Parkinson's disease because that's where the effect is most apparent. The reward mechanisms ARE how the placebo works: you are giving your patient an innocuous chemical which he thinks it's medicine (something good for his body). Thus, the reward mechanisms of the patient are triggered and dopamine is produced. Moreover, the biochemistry of the placebo effect in Parkinson's might help in the near future to have a better understanding of how it works in general.

It's just as if a man in the 1600s said that we could not possibly ever hope to explain lightning via physics because no one had come up with a scientific explanation since the dawn of mankind. You're just being unreasonable and impatient. I can't explain that, therefore god is one of the worst possible arguments one could ever come up with.

Then find a study on how dopamine affects cancer...I'll wait.

Find me a study that shows God performing miracles?

(September 17, 2014 at 12:06 pm)FatAndFaithless Wrote:

(September 17, 2014 at 12:05 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: Then find a study on how dopamine affects cancer...I'll wait.

Find me a study that shows God performing miracles?

I actually posted one earlier in the thread.

(August 12, 2014 at 6:57 pm)Huggy74 Wrote: Some may be familiar with the story of Pentecost, where tongues of fire was seen to hang over the people.

Quote:Acts 2
And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

Which brings me to this photograph taken at the Sam Houston Coliseum in Houston, Texas On the night of January 24, 1950.
Original Photograph

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This photograph was examined by George J. Lacy, (who worked for the FBI as Investigator of Questioned Documents, and would become the president of The American Society of
Questioned Document Examiners in 1956) subjected the negative to every scientific test available.

Photocopy of George J. Lacey's official report and conclusion concerning the tests run on the photograph.

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His conclusion,

Quote:Based upon the above described examination and study I am of the definite opinion that the negative submitted for examination, was not retouched nor was it a composite or double exposed negative.
Further, I am of the definite opinion that the light streak appearing above the head in a halo position was caused by the light striking the negative.

Respectfully submitted,

George J. Lacy.

he also made this statement at a news conference, “To my knowledge, this is the first time in all the world’s history that a supernatural being has been photographed and scientifically vindicated.”

More about American Society of Questioned Document Examiners from Wikipedia:

Quote:The American Society of Questioned Document Examiners is the world's oldest society dedicated to the forensic science of questioned document examination with 144 members worldwide. The current president is James A. Green. The society publishes the Journal of the American Society of Questioned Document Examiners twice a year.