That is an odd bible verse. It kind of sounds like either the man or woman can demand sex and not be refused, though it doesn't quite say it explicitly.

About the first time ive seen men and women in equal, albeit weird, positions.

So... On that parody site, is everyone just signing up to it to act like religious nutters? Is it an active forum, or just a bank of stuff?

And would you get some real nut cases signing up, thinking they'd found others of their kind?

(December 2, 2014 at 10:41 am)Nope Wrote: There isn't any way to defend this passage. Religious people can't get around the passage by saying that it is only reporting historical events in a neutral fashion. Obviously, god is telling the Hebrews how to treat female captives.

What makes you think this passage needs a defense?

Quote:Imagine, you are a young woman and have just seen your family slaughtered. The person who might have personally killed your parents, kidnaps you and forces you to be his bride. That would be nightmarish.

It completely depends on who your family was. You people all assume that the people the Jews were told to obliterate were good hard working red blooded folks. Look at al queida and ISIS is it that much of a strech that 4 or 5 thousand years ago there were people a lot worse than anything this current generation could ever hope to produce, and God had the Jew wipe them from the planet so that nations of them numbering in the billions would not infest the earth now?

Just for a moment assume God was good and had an eye on the furture. What if he knew a people with a certain genetic trait or a certain mental disipline would indeed be the destruction of the world? would it not be better to destroy those people before they destroyed everything and everyone else?

Quote:Numbers 31:7-18 NLT)

They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men. All five of the Midianite kings – Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba – died in the battle. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. Then the Israelite army captured the Midianite women and children and seized their cattle and flocks and all their wealth as plunder. They burned all the towns and villages where the Midianites had lived. After they had gathered the plunder and captives, both people and animals, they brought them all to Moses and Eleazar the priest, and to the whole community of Israel, which was camped on the plains of Moab beside the Jordan River, across from Jericho.

Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. "Why have you let all the women live?" he demanded. "These are the very ones who followed Balaam's advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD's people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.

Quote:Again, the Israelites massacred a town and kept the young women for themselves.

Again so what?

Quote:Let's don't forget Lot. When the crowd were demanding to rape the angels, Lot offered his two daughters to be raped. Although the angels prevent the attack, the bible says that Lot was a righteous man

Then also don't forget that "Lot's actions" were not commanded nor supported by the Lord nor his angels. Lot was a confused soul trying to save his lost city from the comming wrath of God.

2 Peter 17

Quote:But God also rescued Lot out of Sodom because he was a righteous man who was sick of the shameful immorality of the wicked people around him.

[/quote]
2 peter does not go to chapter 17.
here is 2 peter 2:4-11
4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; 5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly; 6 and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7 and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8 (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)— 9 then the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment, 10 and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of dignitaries, 11 whereas angels, who are greater in power and might, do not bring a reviling accusation against them before the Lord.

(December 3, 2014 at 2:06 pm)Drich Wrote: Look at al queida and ISIS is it that much of a strech that 4 or 5 thousand years ago there were people a lot worse than anything this current generation could ever hope to produce, and God had the Jew wipe them from the planet so that nations of them numbering in the billions would not infest the earth now?

Funny you should mention them. They use the same argument as you, just citing a different book.

(December 3, 2014 at 2:06 pm)Drich Wrote: Just for a moment assume God was good and had an eye on the furture. What if he knew a people with a certain genetic trait or a certain mental disipline would indeed be the destruction of the world? would it not be better to destroy those people before they destroyed everything and everyone else?

If we're going to play the wouldn't-it-have-been-better game, then... wouldn't it have been better for God not to have created those people in the first place?

(December 3, 2014 at 2:06 pm)Drich Wrote: Then also don't forget that "Lot's actions" were not commanded nor supported by the Lord nor his angels. Lot was a confused soul trying to save his lost city from the comming wrath of God.

Yet Lot was the one person God saw as being 'righteous enough' to spare (along with his family). Considering that this happened right after Lot offered his daughters up to be gang raped, it looks a lot like God was indeed condoning this. In fact, it looks like God was saying, "I like your style. Come with me so you can continue in your perversions."

(December 3, 2014 at 2:02 pm)robvalue Wrote: That is an odd bible verse. It kind of sounds like either the man or woman can demand sex and not be refused, though it doesn't quite say it explicitly.

About the first time ive seen men and women in equal, albeit weird, positions.

So... On that parody site, is everyone just signing up to it to act like religious nutters? Is it an active forum, or just a bank of stuff?

And would you get some real nut cases signing up, thinking they'd found others of their kind?

It is difficult sometimes determine which sites are Christian parodies and which are real Christian sites.

I am pretty certain that this site is not parody. Apparently, the writer believes that rape is not unlawful for a husband but not a wise thing to do. The woman who refuses to have sex is sinful.

http://www.deepstrength.wordpress.com/20...pe-or-not/

The cite is a parody. The city and church do not exist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landover_Baptist_Church

Yup. It is. But the problem is that it's not that far outside the thoughts of some Christians, if it is outside them at all. The site Nope posted doesn't look like a parody. And et story of the Republican candidate who says it's not a thing are all too real.

Rape and evil in the bible?

Tell me it ain't so!

(December 3, 2014 at 2:53 pm)Beccs Wrote: Rape and evil in the bible?

Tell me it ain't so!

It ain't so. God told me as much. And I don't need everyone to believe me--just 12

(December 3, 2014 at 2:36 pm)JonDarbyXIII Wrote: If we're going to play the wouldn't-it-have-been-better game, then... wouldn't it have been better for God not to have created those people in the first place?

Better for whom?

It was better for them to have existed from Israel's position, as Israel took the lands which those people cultivated, rather than wilderness. They also got additional wives, which are necessary for a polygamous society in which most all men are expected to marry.

It would have been better for the wicked who hated god to never have existed.

So, who should God reward, his chosen people or his enemies?

Quote:Yet Lot was the one person God saw as being 'righteous enough' to spare (along with his family). Considering that this happened right after Lot offered his daughters up to be gang raped, it looks a lot like God was indeed condoning this. In fact, it looks like God was saying, "I like your style. Come with me so you can continue in your perversions."

Considering that Lot's wife was destroyed and Lot ended up living in caves in the hills, I'd have to disagree. It seems more likely to me that God was angry with Lot as well, but at least spared his life for Abraham's sake.

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(December 3, 2014 at 2:41 pm)Nope Wrote: I am pretty certain that this site is not parody. Apparently, the writer believes that rape is not unlawful for a husband but not a wise thing to do. The woman who refuses to have sex is sinful.

http://www.deepstrength.wordpress.com/20...pe-or-not/

Actually he comes to the final conclusion that "forcing sex on the spouse is a sin."

(December 3, 2014 at 3:11 pm)alpha male Wrote: Considering that Lot's wife was destroyed and Lot ended up living in caves in the hills, I'd have to disagree. It seems more likely to me that God was angry with Lot as well, but at least spared his life for Abraham's sake.

Lot's wife died as a result of her own actions (moral lesson: don't look over your shoulder....for some reason or other) Besides, the Abraham's entire argument when he was bargaining with God was a petition so save 'the righteous.' Sodom and Gomorrah were supposedly destroyed because of sexual sin; yet you're saying that God punished Lot's sexual sin by letting him live?