nothing. They were two separate points that seemed to be contradicting each other, yet a lot of people have both those personality traits, which was my point. On philosophical tests I'm apparently more prone to the skeptical answer. However if I had to be either optimistic or pessimistic about an outcome I was skeptical about, I typically choose optimism. Yes that's biasing, but I think it's more productive than being a skeptic and a pessimist.

(August 4, 2010 at 6:17 am)Ace Wrote:

(August 4, 2010 at 5:17 am)AnunZi Wrote: So my question to you Ace is this.

Why should aliens giving even more evidence change anything?

It won't...

By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

(August 11, 2010 at 8:20 pm)AngelThMan Wrote:

(August 4, 2010 at 6:17 am)Ace Wrote:

(August 4, 2010 at 5:17 am)AnunZi Wrote: So my question to you Ace is this.

Why should aliens giving even more evidence change anything?

It won't...

By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

not me. if Jesus rode down the skies on his brilliant white horse wielding a double handed sword in one hand epically... I would totally be like 'omg jeesus i'm so sorry for not believing in you. i mean i still have questions but I definitely believe you exist. please don't send me to hell for eternity!!!!" hahahaahahahaha no really i'm not joking. some atheists might spit in his face or try to anyway (jesus will obviously cause the spit to annihilate before it hits him or he will do what he supposedly did the first time and let people spit on him. i dont know. mysterious) and say "You are evil! I would rather go to hell than believe in you because of all the suffering you allow in the world that has nothing to do with our 'free will'" but I don't want to go to hell. sounds like a bad place.

(March 9, 2010 at 3:06 am)Loki_999 Wrote: This should be a short thread....

Guess not. He must have hit a nerve.

(August 11, 2010 at 3:46 pm)tackattack Wrote: nothing. They were two separate points that seemed to be contradicting each other, yet a lot of people have both those personality traits, which was my point.

And a lot of people dont... so what is your point?

Quote: On philosophical tests I'm apparently more prone to the skeptical answer. However if I had to be either optimistic or pessimistic about an outcome I was skeptical about, I typically choose optimism. Yes that's biasing, but I think it's more productive than being a skeptic and a pessimist.

Why says you have to "choose" a bias? Why not withhold judgement until the evidence comes in (which is what skepticism is... and I'm glad you agree with me it has nothing to do with optimism or pessimism).

(August 11, 2010 at 8:20 pm)AngelThMan Wrote: By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

If God ostensibly dropped from the sky how could anyone tell that it actually was God?

(August 11, 2010 at 8:20 pm)AngelThMan Wrote: By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

People who make a statement like this demonstrate that they haven't a clue about how atheists think. The vast majority of atheists (myself included) don't believe in a deity because there is no evidence for the existence of a deity. If this deity were to suddenly "drop down from the sky" we would certainly have evidence! Of course, this being would then have to demonstrate that he (or she, or it) is, in fact, "God". Not to mention WHICH "God".

(August 3, 2010 at 1:50 pm)Rhizomorph13 Wrote: Magic underwear and sex through a hole in the sheet are what come to mind when I think about Mormonism. Oh, also the fact that men will get their own planet to fill with their harem of women they collect on Earth and women can't get to heaven except through a man. I guess that is just payback because men can't get to Earth except through a woman.

(August 12, 2010 at 10:46 am)Thor Wrote:

(August 11, 2010 at 8:20 pm)AngelThMan Wrote: By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

People who make a statement like this demonstrate that they haven't a clue about how atheists think. The vast majority of atheists (myself included) don't believe in a deity because there is no evidence for the existence of a deity. If this deity were to suddenly "drop down from the sky" we would certainly have evidence! Of course, this being would then have to demonstrate that he (or she, or it) is, in fact, "God". Not to mention WHICH "God".

Personnally I'd be worried about my mental health.
People who think they actually encounter god tend to be crazy and often go on to commit murder, ( I'm thinking of Peter Sutcliffe 'the yorkshire ripper' here, but I'm sure you can think of others)

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/seria...ue_13.html

But what exactly would differntiate god from a powerful alien invader?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBwoEXlTph0

(August 11, 2010 at 8:20 pm)AngelThMan Wrote: By the same token, if God dropped from the sky tomorrow, atheists would still find a way to deny it was actually God.

Don't you mean two thousand years ago? And that he left us no contemporary historical evidence of his existence that is external from Biblical scholarship?

Again, I hate to correct you, but I don't want you to confuse theological beliefs with future events/scenarios that are remotely plausible, possible or probable.

That isn't true Angel. If I denied the existence of polar bears, all anyone would have to do to prove me wrong is take me to the north pole, or a zoo for that matter, and show me a polar bear. It wouldn't be miracles performed by said polar bear, it would be an enormous bear covered in white fur kicking a seals ass. That would be sufficient evidence.

God manifested himself biblically to the israelites by burning bushes, pillars of smoke, and clouds with big booming voices shooting lightning at stone tablets. Now he can apparently only muster the power to appear in toast and tortilla shells. If a god manifested himself in a way that could only be reflective of what we define as being a god, then i would say, well, certainly can't debunk a cloud texting me on stone tablets and speaking like James Earl Jones. However that doesn't happen, and so far as we know, has never happened.

(August 12, 2010 at 4:31 pm)SleepingDemon Wrote: Now he can apparently only muster the power to appear in toast and tortilla shells.

It may work like it does in Terry Pratchetts books (especially Small Gods). A god must have lots of true believers to work big miracles. Back in the day he had lots of true believers so could do big miracles.

These days he is limited to a relative handful who really really believe in him (the rest just going through the motions) and so the best he can manage is the aforementioned toast/tortilla.

Come on everyone, in order to see miracles we need to really believe in god!!! And of course, this is the problem. True believers tend to see miracles where atheists see only natural processes, luck, or coincidence.