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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 16, 2015 at 6:45 pm
(February 16, 2015 at 7:04 am)Bad Wolf Wrote: (February 16, 2015 at 5:40 am)Irrational Wrote: So your problem is that they are just really fucking loud? What a silly objection to have regarding feminists.
No, her point was that the bad feminists are 'loud' in the sense that they appear everywhere and are popular in the media, therefore giving real feminists a bad name.
(February 16, 2015 at 5:40 am)Irrational Wrote: Do you want feminists to be quiet and meek like all women are expected to be by traditional gender expectations while men are the only ones allowed to be aggressive?
Okay, how about next time you wait for a response to your initial question before coming to a conclusion that you would like.
(February 16, 2015 at 5:40 am)Irrational Wrote: By the way, regarding the alarm. It's not dishonesty if the intention was to just disrupt the meeting and not to alert to some fire.
Right so it wasn't dishonest to use dishonest tactics to prevent a meeting? Instead of discussing anything with them, they were being 'honest' when they physically prevented their meeting from taking place. Also, it was dishonest as fire alarms are meant for emergencies. Taking away firefighters that could be helping someone else. You know, its almost like you believe that these feminists were justified in pulling the fire alarm? As crazy as that sounds.
(February 16, 2015 at 5:40 am)Irrational Wrote: For God's sake, please someone tell me what was so horrid about that website. What did these nasty evil people actually say that would make them such a nightmare in the eyes of critical thinking skeptical bunch of atheists? I think we've found a former member
No, I was never a member there, but I'd love to join. They sound like a cool group from what I've read.
Also who are the real feminists then? Only those who are not popular in the media? Or something else? Could you be less vague?
I am sensing a lot of bias around here, and it's a little disappointing to see that you guys are letting your biases get the better of you regarding this topic.
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 16, 2015 at 7:06 pm
(February 16, 2015 at 6:45 pm)Irrational Wrote: No, I was never a member there, but I'd love to join. They sound like a cool group from what I've read. The more you post, the more I think you would fit in there.
(February 16, 2015 at 6:45 pm)Irrational Wrote: Also who are the real feminists then? Only those who are not popular in the media? Or something else? Could you be less vague?
I don't know, we could start our definition with a someone who doesn't hate men and use bullying tactics to get what they want.
(February 16, 2015 at 6:45 pm)Irrational Wrote: I am sensing a lot of bias around here, and it's a little disappointing to see that you guys are letting your biases get the better of you regarding this topic.
I'm biased? I'm not the one defending a group of feminists who pulled a fire alarm just to prevent a seminar. In any other situation, you would be condeming this. If a group of atheists pulled the fire alarm in a a church in the middle of a sermon, you would condemn it. If a bunch of creationists pulled the fire alarm in the middle of a lecture on evolution, you would condemn it. Take a look at your own bias.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 16, 2015 at 7:24 pm
(February 16, 2015 at 7:06 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: (February 16, 2015 at 6:45 pm)Irrational Wrote: Also who are the real feminists then? Only those who are not popular in the media? Or something else? Could you be less vague?
I don't know, we could start our definition with a someone who doesn't hate men and use bullying tactics to get what they want. [/quote]
Sorry, Wolf, this doesn't work for me. Clearly, a woman who hates all men, thinks every man deserves to have his dick cut off, and is planning for an Amazonian domination of the world, is a feminist.
So's a nice Christian lady who believes God created all people equal, and that it's therefore un-Christian to hold women as inferior.
So are the average Western men and women who see that the majority of jobs today don't require much physical strength, and that women are not inferior in other ways and should therefore not be treated as inferior.
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 3:59 am
(February 16, 2015 at 7:24 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Sorry, Wolf, this doesn't work for me. Clearly, a woman who hates all men, thinks every man deserves to have his dick cut off, and is planning for an Amazonian domination of the world, is a feminist.
No she isn't. Feminism is about equality, this woman isn't a feminist she's a female supremacist, sexist and a misandrist.
But my point was that it was ridiculous for irrational to ask what a real feminist is because there are too many people claiming different definitions and its all subjective.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 3:30 pm
(February 17, 2015 at 3:59 am)Bad Wolf Wrote: No she isn't. Feminism is about equality, this woman isn't a feminist she's a female supremacist, sexist and a misandrist.
But my point was that it was ridiculous for irrational to ask what a real feminist is because there are too many people claiming different definitions and its all subjective. Feminism is not a brand name, so you don't get to define it that precisely. "-ism" means a philosophy or ideology about something. So any position which represents ideas about the betterment of females qualifies as feminism.
And I find it weird that you are saying so strongly what feminism is (or isn't) and then saying that to ask what a real feminist is is irrational.
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 4:04 pm
(February 17, 2015 at 3:30 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Feminism is not a brand name, so you don't get to define it that precisely. "-ism" means a philosophy or ideology about something. So any position which represents ideas about the betterment of females qualifies as feminism.
In the same sentance you tell me I can't define feminism, and then you define feminism.
(February 17, 2015 at 3:30 pm)bennyboy Wrote: And I find it weird that you are saying so strongly what feminism is (or isn't) and then saying that to ask what a real feminist is is irrational.
I didn't say it was irrational, I was talking about Irrational. I should have capitalised his name.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 5:26 pm
(This post was last modified: February 17, 2015 at 5:28 pm by bennyboy.)
(February 17, 2015 at 4:04 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: (February 17, 2015 at 3:30 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Feminism is not a brand name, so you don't get to define it that precisely. "-ism" means a philosophy or ideology about something. So any position which represents ideas about the betterment of females qualifies as feminism.
In the same sentance you tell me I can't define feminism, and then you define feminism. No. I said you can't limit the definition of feminism so narrowly. The kind of feminist you're talking about is definitely a feminist. But there are feminists who don't meet your definition. Your definition is like saying one can only be an atheist if one believes that God doesn't exist-- it deliberately excludes some, or many, people about whom the term can be sensibly used.
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 6:18 pm
(February 17, 2015 at 5:26 pm)bennyboy Wrote: No. I said you can't limit the definition of feminism so narrowly. The kind of feminist you're talking about is definitely a feminist. But there are feminists who don't meet your definition.
Then they aren't feminists. A feminist is someone who wants equal rights for both sexes. This is the definition of feminism made by feminists.
(February 17, 2015 at 5:26 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Your definition is like saying one can only be an atheist if one believes that God doesn't exist-- it deliberately excludes some, or many, people about whom the term can be sensibly used.
No, my definition is like saying one can only be an atheist if you don't believe in any gods. You can only be a feminist if you want equality. Otherwise what's the point of having labels for a group and their specific cause if it encompasses lots of people with differing opinions on the exact position that their group has.
'The more I learn about people the more I like my dog'- Mark Twain
'You can have all the faith you want in spirits, and the afterlife, and heaven and hell, but when it comes to this world, don't be an idiot. Cause you can tell me you put your faith in God to put you through the day, but when it comes time to cross the road, I know you look both ways.' - Dr House
“Young earth creationism is essentially the position that all of modern science, 90% of living scientists and 98% of living biologists, all major university biology departments, every major science journal, the American Academy of Sciences, and every major science organization in the world, are all wrong regarding the origins and development of life….but one particular tribe of uneducated, bronze aged, goat herders got it exactly right.” - Chuck Easttom
"If my good friend Doctor Gasparri speaks badly of my mother, he can expect to get punched.....You cannot provoke. You cannot insult the faith of others. You cannot make fun of the faith of others. There is a limit." - Pope Francis on freedom of speech
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 6:42 pm
Geez I didn't realize this exploded.
They're much more tolerant on the Atheism + forums now.
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RE: So did Atheism + bite the dust?
February 17, 2015 at 7:17 pm
(This post was last modified: February 17, 2015 at 7:21 pm by bennyboy.)
(February 17, 2015 at 6:18 pm)Bad Wolf Wrote: (February 17, 2015 at 5:26 pm)bennyboy Wrote: No. I said you can't limit the definition of feminism so narrowly. The kind of feminist you're talking about is definitely a feminist. But there are feminists who don't meet your definition.
Then they aren't feminists. A feminist is someone who wants equal rights for both sexes. This is the definition of feminism made by feminists. Not all of them. And by the way, "Bad Wolf" sounds like a male name. If you are in fact a guy, I challenge you to go find some so-called "feminazis," and tell them to their faces that they aren't real feminists. Tell them that you, a man, know what feminism really is, and that they are using the word wrongly.
I believe you will look comical with a dictionary shoved up your ass. 
Quote: (February 17, 2015 at 5:26 pm)bennyboy Wrote: Your definition is like saying one can only be an atheist if one believes that God doesn't exist-- it deliberately excludes some, or many, people about whom the term can be sensibly used.
No, my definition is like saying one can only be an atheist if you don't believe in any gods. You can only be a feminist if you want equality. Otherwise what's the point of having labels for a group and their specific cause if it encompasses lots of people with differing opinions on the exact position that their group has. You keep saying that, and you are still wrong. The problem is that you aren't looking at the word, but how it is applied in your world, by the people you personally know who identify by that word. The word means what it means, and no matter how many times you describe your particular flavor of Feminism™, your word does not cover many people who use the word "feminist" about themselves and do not mean what you want to force them to mean.
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