The guy from "the atheist voice" is pretty cool and reasonable, I like him. I don't follow anyone else regularly.

PZ Meyers ----> Atheism+ -----> total twat

Atheism plus should have been called atheism plus fascism, and anyone involved in creating such an environment has no respect from me.

(March 16, 2015 at 6:11 pm)Faith No More Wrote: PZ Meyers ----> Atheism+ -----> total twat

Atheism plus should have been called atheism plus fascism, and anyone involved in creating such an environment has no respect from me.

Seems a bit simple to me. What exactly did he do?

(March 16, 2015 at 6:22 pm)Alex K Wrote: Seems a bit simple to me. What exactly did he do?

There are a lot who take it a tad too far. I'm not familiar with the guy in question, but it's a general observation. That's why I don't do hero worship. I like to listen to some of the youtube atheists such as Matt Dillahunty or AronRa. Generally I also like Dawkins for his humorous attitude. But many of the well known atheists are virtually preaching from the Ivory Tower, which doesn't help matters at all, since it reaches nobody unless they're already in their camp. Also they often transport dubious messages that can turn out to be just as bad as religious bigotry.

(March 16, 2015 at 5:58 pm)Pandæmonium Wrote: I've always disliked myers and A+ mainly because A+ itself is generally as welcoming to people who don't espouse their given political/social ideas as ISIS is to, well, anyone who doesn't espouse their beliefs. Minus the beheadings and burning alive of people, naturally.

I don't want this thread to get derailed into an Atheism Plus debate but I need to address this comment. Atheism Plus was just a group within Atheism, it was never meant to represent Atheism as a whole. It was just a group for like-minded people who think atheists should do more than just debate religion. If you don't share the views of a certain group, then you don't have to be part of it. No one had a gun held to their head.

How is it any different than the faction of libertarian/conservative-leaning atheists who are obsessed with attacking feminism and muslims everyday? I have tried to discuss these issues rationally with many of them and they definitely don't greet me with open arms so does that mean you are against them as well? Or is that acceptable just because they don't have an official name? Personally, I call them Atheism Negative. If you are wondering who I mean, I am talking about people like the Unholy Quadrality of Atheism: Thunderf00t, AmazingAtheist, Jacelyn Glenn and Pat Condell. Those people aren't exactly friendly toward those of us with opposing views. You will find that in any group, which is why you don't have to join any specific group within Atheism. That is my two cents.

(March 16, 2015 at 6:00 pm)Alex K Wrote:

(March 16, 2015 at 5:50 pm)abentwookie Wrote: I have heard Matt Dillhunty and several others mention him but I haven't had a chance to check out any of this work yet.

A philosopher who knows the science. What's not to love. I just like his style - he's very smart, unyielding, yet manages to be charming in the process.

Here's maybe an illustration of what I mean (starting near 15:00)

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTepA-WV_oE

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Some important works - Consciousness Explained, Darwin's Dangerous Idea, Breaking The Spell.

Okay, I will take a look at that as soon as I finish eating.

(March 16, 2015 at 6:05 pm)Dystopia Wrote: The guy from "the atheist voice" is pretty cool and reasonable, I like him. I don't follow anyone else regularly.

Oh yeah, I forgot Hemant Mehta.

I can see liking someone's work but the term "fan" to me I don't like. These people are humans with lives and while we might like their public personas unless you know them personally and deal with them on a daily basis like their families and co workers do, all you can do really is say you like their work.

I like most of what Sam Harris has to say about religion, but I am no fan of his Buddhism stuff. I like Bill Maher but he has baggage with vaccines and medicines. Love Neil Tyson's Cosmos. Hitch has been gone a while but love his work although lots of it is wordy. Ayaan Hersi Ali, Dawkins,

BUT the least talked about but I think one of the most important atheist authors is the late Victor Stenger and his books "God The Failed Hypothesis" and "The New Atheism".

(March 16, 2015 at 6:11 pm)Faith No More Wrote: PZ Meyers ----> Atheism+ -----> total twat

Atheism plus should have been called atheism plus fascism, and anyone involved in creating such an environment has no respect from me.

Fascists despise social justice and they probably oppose 99% of the things atheism plus stands for except for the censorship part.

Like I said, I don't follow any atheists or any atheist channels anywhere on the Internet. I've never felt the need to.

I'm an egalitarian, so the 'ideas' behind A+, especially its pro-feminism, are not something I necessarily disagreed with in their entirety (that said, I find a lot of debates on feminism are often destroyed by people on both sides of the divide who have no understanding of liberation based politics). However I found A+ to be the complete opposite of what they professed to be (inclusive, pro-equality and fairness etc). There are theist forums more welcoming than the A+ forums. Thus I am against any group that censors people simply for believing in something different (which demonstrably happened over and over again on A+ - blockbot). By all means, start a group for like minded individuals, invite and ban whoever you want. But don't expect people to like it when they're silenced for simply disagreeing. Censorship doesn't get an organisation very far in the long run, and my experiences of A+ directly and indirectly were almost entirely negative from this standpoint.

Indeed, the entire notion that there can be an organised group with an MO within atheism seems absurd to me. Heards of cats come to mind. A lot of atheists may share a common ground (political, economic, social), but their atheism is irrelevent. A lack of belief in a deity doesn't inform any of my political or social beliefs. This forum is a good example. A diverse membership, mostly atheist naturally, and many agreeing and disagreeing on various points (the owner is a libertarian for example, I am not, but I'm still staff), but you'd be hard pushed to find people saying they're [x] within atheism.

Overall, to be short, I found A+ to be completely counter productive to the cause they were trying to promote (and to which I agree with).

EDIT: Sorry, using mod privileges to edit my post!

Cato posted a good link that details some of the reason I really didn't like A+ - http://www.skepticink.com/avant-garde/20...-atheists/

(March 16, 2015 at 6:22 pm)Alex K Wrote: Seems a bit simple to me. What exactly did he do?

Here's a start...

http://www.michaelnugent.com/2014/12/16/...y-atheist/

It seems that he is not above personal smears towards anyone he disagrees with, and he was influential in starting the atheism+ movement, which was really just a collection of "social justice warriors" that have more in common with Tumblr than free-thought. They are quick to ban and ridicule any dissenting opinion and think that all atheists should conform to their monolithic mindset. I remember reading a quote where he called any atheist against atheism+ an asshole, but I couldn't find it.

I realize none of this is probably the smoking gun you were looking for, but I don't have the patience to parse through his bullshit to find the real gems. If you're still skeptical but want more, I suggest reading some of his words on social justice and feminism especially or even go to the atheism plus forum if you dare.

Tim Minchkin (sp?)
Ricky
Eddie Izzard? I think he is.

There are a few Youtubers my teenager follows, but couldn't tell their names.