The European wars of religion are proof positive that it was all about wealth and power....after the 30 Years' War, they had the same exact wars but they were labeled as the wars of succession.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:13 pm)Polaris Wrote: The European wars of religion are proof positive that it was all about wealth and power....after the 30 Years' War, they had the same exact wars but they were labeled as the wars of succession.

European religious wars were about religion. 

Religious wars are fucking ridiculous.

"I'm going to prove my God is real by killing people while he sits around doing absolutely nothing."

Good job numb nuts. I think if there's one true God and he's on your side, you wouldn't need a sword to prove anything.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:22 pm)dyresand Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:13 pm)Polaris Wrote: The European wars of religion are proof positive that it was all about wealth and power....after the 30 Years' War, they had the same exact wars but they were labeled as the wars of succession.

European religious wars were about religion. 

So explain why France, a Catholic nation, sided with the Protestants against other Catholic nations in the 30 Years' War.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:30 pm)Polaris Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:22 pm)dyresand Wrote: European religious wars were about religion. 

So explain why France, a Catholic nation, sided with the Protestants against other Catholic nations in the 30 Years' War.

 It was kind of a the enemy of my enemy is my friend thing. France wanted to break the power of the Catholic Hapsburgs monarchs, who ruled in Spain, Austria, and the Holy Roman Empire (modern Germany). One way to do this was to side with the Protestants, who also fought against the Hapsburgs in the Holy Roman empire. 
Also, France also made an alliance with the Ottoman Empire, to counter the Hapsburgs--The first Catholic country to make an alliance with a Muslim one.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:34 pm)dyresand Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:30 pm)Polaris Wrote: So explain why France, a Catholic nation, sided with the Protestants against other Catholic nations in the 30 Years' War.

 It was kind of a the enemy of my enemy is my friend thing. France wanted to break the power of the Catholic Hapsburgs monarchs, who ruled in Spain, Austria, and the Holy Roman Empire (modern Germany). One way to do this was to side with the Protestants, who also fought against the Hapsburgs in the Holy Roman empire. 
Also, France also made an alliance with the Ottoman Empire, to counter the Hapsburgs--The first Catholic country to make an alliance with a Muslim one.

So you agree it was really about politics.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:35 pm)Polaris Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:34 pm)dyresand Wrote:  It was kind of a the enemy of my enemy is my friend thing. France wanted to break the power of the Catholic Hapsburgs monarchs, who ruled in Spain, Austria, and the Holy Roman Empire (modern Germany). One way to do this was to side with the Protestants, who also fought against the Hapsburgs in the Holy Roman empire. 
Also, France also made an alliance with the Ottoman Empire, to counter the Hapsburgs--The first Catholic country to make an alliance with a Muslim one.

So you agree it was really about politics.

It was still about religion because, the Hapsburg Holy Roman Emperors were trying to enforce Catholicism as the dominant religion throughout much of Germany by military force. Nothing about it was political. 

(April 12, 2015 at 5:38 pm)dyresand Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:35 pm)Polaris Wrote: So you agree it was really about politics.

It was still about religion because, the Hapsburg Holy Roman Emperors were trying to enforce Catholicism as the dominant religion throughout much of Germany by military force. Nothing about it was political. 

So it was about the Holy Roman Empire reclaiming the Germanic nation states.

(April 12, 2015 at 5:40 pm)Polaris Wrote:

(April 12, 2015 at 5:38 pm)dyresand Wrote: It was still about religion because, the Hapsburg Holy Roman Emperors were trying to enforce Catholicism as the dominant religion throughout much of Germany by military force. Nothing about it was political. 

So it was about the Holy Roman Empire reclaiming the Germanic nation states.

By force and wanting to spread the religion through violence enough said they wanted to reclaim their land and reclaim their citizens through fear and religion.
Like ISIS modern day they want to spread a dumb ass idea that pretty much fucked up their civilization from progression to other areas in the world through fear and violence. 
Except its not really working only morons join them. 

(April 12, 2015 at 5:03 pm)Dystopia Wrote: @Simon I'm sorry but some of those States (if not all) actually declared themselves literally atheist states - Russia did it at least. That doesn't change anything, it just shows an hostility towards religious beliefs

But none of them, with the exemption of North Korea and possibly Pol Pot's regime, actually forbid excercising religion. They only made it more difficult by regulating the hell out of them. There was no actual persecution simply for being religious.