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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 12:58 pm
(July 19, 2015 at 9:07 am)Randy Carson Wrote: Think of each of these five facts - accepted AS FACTS (not opinions) by professional NT scholars of all faith positions (believers and non-believers alike) - as signposts pointing toward a destination - namely, that Jesus of Nazareth rose from the dead.
I also want to point out that you're presenting an appeal to majority/authority. You're saying 2 things in this statement here:
- Many people accept it as fact (appeal to majority)
- Those people are professional NT scholars of all faith positions (appeal to authority)
You're saying that because many people accept it as true, and that they have credentials, that your statements must be true. That's not how discussions work.
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians! 
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 12:59 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2015 at 12:59 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(July 19, 2015 at 12:57 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: The truth is out there. ![[Image: sad_yes.gif]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=forums.catholic.com%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Fani%2Fsad_yes.gif) It may be "out there", but it isn't in -your posts-...and that's the problem......or was that not clear?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:00 pm
Are you reading my mind again, Rhythm? 
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:00 pm
(July 19, 2015 at 12:57 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: The truth is out there.
Yes it is and god isn't part of it. God is a denizen of the minds of the gullible.
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:01 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2015 at 1:01 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(July 19, 2015 at 1:00 pm)Neimenovic Wrote: Are you reading my mind again, Rhythm?
Only always......and you're a sick...sick person...btw. 
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:01 pm
(July 19, 2015 at 12:53 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: (July 19, 2015 at 9:56 am)IanHulett Wrote: Is there a reason you're ignoring EVERYTHING I'M SAYING? I'M NOT SAYING GOD DOESN'T EXIST. Stop twisting my words, and stop shifting the burden of proof. You're making the assertion that god exists, and so it's YOU'RE JOB TO PROVE IT.
According to the majority of religious people, no matter what evidence you provide for them, they will never change their mind, so no it doesn't depend on the evidence. They explicitly say that.
Gee. Thanks for taking me off the hook when I was never on the hook to begin with. I was never making a positive assertion. You're just presenting a straw man, accusing me of saying something I never said in order to escape the burden of proof you placed on yourself.
And I did take into consideration your five "facts," just as any skeptic would, but they didn't add up. Sorry.
---
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Remember when I said you were being intellectually dishonest? Well, you just proved my point.
Or you proved you didn't understand what I was saying. It's okay. We can move on.
Dude? What the fuck are you talking about?
You came here presenting "facts," and when I said they didn't add up, you claim that I didn't understand what you're saying. There are plenty of rebuttals to your argument through out this thread. Are you refusing to consider them? Why are you even bothering trying to discuss this?
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians!
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:03 pm
He's not discussing, he's not here to discuss, he's here to proselytize.....clear that up for you?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:03 pm
(July 19, 2015 at 12:58 pm)IanHulett Wrote: (July 19, 2015 at 9:07 am)Randy Carson Wrote: Think of each of these five facts - accepted AS FACTS (not opinions) by professional NT scholars of all faith positions (believers and non-believers alike) - as signposts pointing toward a destination - namely, that Jesus of Nazareth rose from the dead.
I also want to point out that you're presenting an appeal to majority/authority. You're saying 2 things in this statement here:
- Many people accept it as fact (appeal to majority)
- Those people are professional NT scholars of all faith positions (appeal to authority)
You're saying that because many people accept it as true, and that they have credentials, that your statements must be true. That's not how discussions work.
Of course it is.
There is no reason to dispute what reliable, knowledgeable people tell you is true.
Or do you plan to re-work of all Stephen Hawking's calculations just because you don't want to appeal to him as an authority?
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:03 pm
(June 24, 2015 at 10:43 pm)Stimbo Wrote: 1. Obi-Wan Kenobi died in a lightsabre duel.
2. Kenobi's apprentice and former master saw he had risen and appeared to them.
3. Darth Vader, the persecutor of the Jedi, was suddenly changed.
4. Han Solo, the sceptical pilot for Kenobi, was suddenly changed.
5. Kenobi's robes were found to be empty.
Why don't you consider THIS rebuttal? It works perfectly. It shows that your "facts" or "logic" can be used to justify ANYTHING.
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians!
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Let's stop fighting and and start smiling! This is our one and only life to live... let's be friends and live it with smiles!
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RE: Proving The Resurrection By the Minimal Facts Approach
July 19, 2015 at 1:06 pm
(This post was last modified: July 19, 2015 at 1:08 pm by IanHulett.)
(July 19, 2015 at 1:03 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: (July 19, 2015 at 12:58 pm)IanHulett Wrote: I also want to point out that you're presenting an appeal to majority/authority. You're saying 2 things in this statement here:
- Many people accept it as fact (appeal to majority)
- Those people are professional NT scholars of all faith positions (appeal to authority)
You're saying that because many people accept it as true, and that they have credentials, that your statements must be true. That's not how discussions work.
Of course it is.
There is no reason to dispute what reliable, knowledgeable people tell you is true.
Or do you plan to re-work of all Stephen Hawking's calculations just because you don't want to appeal to him as an authority? I don't consider his arguments because he is Stephen Hawking, or at all because I don't know any of his arguments. If I did know them, I would not consider them because of his credentials, I'd consider them based on whether or not they have evidence to support them. That's the difference between you and me. I value evidence and sound logic over what I'm told is true.
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians!
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Let's stop fighting and and start smiling! This is our one and only life to live... let's be friends and live it with smiles!
-- Book of Pinkie Pie 7:3
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