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Free will and humans
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 (March 7, 2016 at 4:18 am)pool the great Wrote:(March 7, 2016 at 3:55 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote: If you have free will would you like to be wealthy? Since you want to be wealthy and you aren't you lack the free will to achieve your goal.  RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:17 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:20 am by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
(March 7, 2016 at 5:06 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote:(March 7, 2016 at 4:18 am)pool the great Wrote: Am I capable of directing my actions in such a manner as to make me rich? I lack the ability to achieve my goal. I poses the free will to undertake actions that may or may not lead to my desired goal. Free will is about performing actions or steps not achieving goals. Example: I have the free will to perform such and such actions so that I can walk out my door and go catch a bus, now whether I am capable of catching a bus or not(capable of accomplishing my task)is independent of my ability to free will to perform these actions that may or may not lead to my desired goal. RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:38 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:42 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Could you "freely will" to chop off your posting hand if that would make you rich? Meh, in any case, you're begging the question by asserting that you can freely will anything as an argument that free will exists. You take actions, you have that ability. How free or willful any given action or ability may be would be another question entirely.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:42 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:43 am by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
I have the capability to perform any set of actions because I poses free will or hence I poses free will.
RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:43 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:44 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Any set? Can you flap your arms and take flight? Is free will required to see action? No, and no.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
In this case flight would be my goal. Can I undertake any set of actions that may or may not lead me to this goal? Yes, which is what free will is.
RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:48 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:50 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Unfortunately...still no, since you just told us that ability and will are not interchangeable. Lacking ability does not equal lacking will, so possessing ability does not equal possessing will (free or otherwise).
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:53 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:55 am by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
Free will is not about accomplishing goals, it's about performing steps or actions that may or may not lead to any given goals.
Does a man with a broken leg poses the free will(freedom of action) to walk (his goal)? Yes he does. Whether he can accomplish his goal or not is irrelevant as it is dependent on his ability as a human being and not dependent on how ability as a human being to freely govern his actions. RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 5:55 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 5:57 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Reasserting your question begging claim, which has become contradictory to your own statements with regards to will in the first place...as an argument that free will exists.
Things without a will of any kind perform steps or actions toward a goal. Clearly, free will is supposed to be more than that...in that theres supposed to be a will involved...which is free (from something?).
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
RE: Free will and humans
March 7, 2016 at 6:17 am
(This post was last modified: March 7, 2016 at 6:21 am by ErGingerbreadMandude.)
Your logic is false, I'll tell you why.
You would consider me a person without free will given that I am incapable of throwing a rock that's as heavy as a mountain, correct? What you seem to be forgetting is the naturally imposed constraints on us such as the physical laws. Essentially you are saying that a ball inside a fence has no freedom of moment since it can't move *everywhere*. By that logic, no object in our world has freedom of moment as our world is a closed system(with boundaries,like the ball inside a fence in my example). What you should be doing is finding an action that cannot be performed even inside the boundaries of the naturally imposed constraints like the physical laws. (which you won't be able to find, which is why we poses free will) |
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