Christian answering questions.

[abaris]

Bones and flesh dissolve, deteriorate, rot or whatever.  It is only under special circumstances that a fossil forms at all, let alone a good one.  So where are all these "transitional species"?  They rotted away like 99%+ of all lifeforms.  That we can find any record of evolution is amazing.

And hardly a year goes by without yet another interesting find.

[Pat Mustard]

My question for someone with your background would be your thoughts on the fossil record as it relates to evolution.  It is my understanding that the fossil record does not support evolution in the sense that there are few, if any, fossils of transitional species.  Examples of fish evolving into land animals and such.  That the record shows several periods of many  new species emerging, but nothing that would show evolving from one species to another.

Well, considering that every fossil is either one of a transitional species or a species that died off without a direct descendant, your first post is wrong. On your point about a seeming lack of evidence, there are a number of threads here with plenty of evidence provided for evolution, from fossil rdcords to DNA to observed speciation with plenty in between. I'd suggest you use the search function before you again declare a paucity of evidence for evolution.

[pocaracas]

Creationists...not even worth more than this

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cO1a1Ek-HD0

[PETE_ROSE]

I can't help but feel that people here are making a lot of assumptions about me.  For starters, I don't go to church, and my knowledge base is not rooted in the rantings of "local pastor lampoons".  I would not discard the Christian bible as a storybook.  I don't watch much television, when I do its generally a documentary or something educational.  I spend most of my free time in a library or on line.  I was not raised in America, so I do not beleive I have been biased by the typical religious upbringing.  In my search for answers and meaning in the world I try to remain open minded and follow the trail wherever it leads.  I did pay attention in school and have always enjoyed learning.  I see a lot more information out there now as we gain understanding and increase our knowledge. 

In regards to using the search function before declaring a paucity for evolution (had to get my dictionary out on that one), I was looking for some conversation on a Saturday night and not merely browsing the forum.  

I do thank you all for the responses and I am looking into the information shared. 

V/R

Pete

[TheRocketSurgeon]

What is a former Biologist?  Are you no longer in the field of study?  I would have a question or two that could possibly be in your wheelhouse.  I myself am not a scientist, nor do I have an abundance of letters after my name in my signature block.  I do believe myself to be intelligent and I honestly do hope to be different from most other professing Christians or theists that have passed through this forum.

I am no longer one because I was working as a field biologist for the state government, when I was incarcerated for nearly a decade for something I didn't do. It would have been longer than a decade, but I won my appeal to show the judge had been biased and that I couldn't have been convicted if I had been allowed to admit evidence that showed I was not guilty. So I was let out with a "so sorry" and what amounted to a shove.

After that long away from the field, I decided I didn't want to go back and take the amount of school and reading it would take to catch up on a decade of research/knowledge, so I decided to turn my hobby of custom motorcycle design and building into a career-- thus my handle. "Rocket Surgeon"... I work on fast motorcycles, now. But I still enjoy talking about science.

As to the discussion of a young earth or the age of the universe I would not think that my opinion on the matter to be a major sticking point within my understanding of Christianity.

Well, for some who are emotionally tied to the idea that EVERY word of the Bible must be literal, they have a lot of trouble looking at the story as an origins myth, or a metaphoric tale, rather than as dictation straight from God to a secretary. There are numerous Christians who are top-level astrophysicists, evolutionary biologists (I frequently point to Dr. Francis Collins, former head of the Human Genome Project), and biochemists, all of whom would tell you why the sciences do say what we claim they say... yet they don't find those facts challenges to their faith. Collins wrote an entire book about it, called The Language of God. More than half of biologists, from studies I've read, report that they are Christians, and they do not find a need to embrace a literal reading of Genesis as their basis for understanding Creation.

I would phrase it, "If your beliefs do not conform to reality, it is not reality that needs to change."

TheRocketSurgeon, thank you for your response and explanation of the forum.  I am  not here to offend anyone.  I am a shy person and thought this medium would give me an opportunity to converse with others and fulfill a need in my life.  

My question for someone with your background would be your thoughts on the fossil record as it relates to evolution.  It is my understanding that the fossil record does not support evolution in the sense that there are few, if any, fossils of transitional species.  Examples of fish evolving into land animals and such.  That the record shows several periods of many  new species emerging, but nothing that would show evolving from one species to another.

There are those (primarily people at the Creation Research Institute, Answers In Genesis, etc.) who make that claim, but it's really a silly one. As has already been pointed out to you, it is rare to find fossils in large part because conditions in which fossils form are very specific, and even then it's mostly the hard parts that get preserved. However, we have used new technologies to look more closely at some, and have found evidence of feathers on Velociraptor-type dinosaurs called theropods (on the way from a branch of the theropods becoming birds) that even allowed us to see what some of the colors were. As for your example of "examples of fish evolving into land animals and such", I'd reference you to 2002 discovery Pederpes finneyae, which was a specific "missing link" they were looking for in the fossil record of the time period between 360 and 345 million years ago... a gap in the record previously known as "Romer's Gap" (see footnote). I won't even direct you anywhere; I'll leave you to Google it yourself, and see how and why it shows what it does, so you know I'm not trying to mislead you by pointing you to biased articles, etc.

If you have any other or more-specific questions, or would like more info about the above (or clarification on what you looked up but couldn't quite understand... I don't expect people to "get" science-writing terminology overnight!), please let me know.

Footnote: Romer's gap ran from approximately 360 to 345 million years ago, corresponding to the first 15 million years of the Carboniferous, the early Mississippian (Tournaisian). The gap forms a discontinuity between the primitive forests and high diversity of fishes in the end Devonian and more modern aquatic and terrestrial assemblages of the early Carboniferous. (Citation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romer%27s_gap)

[abaris]

I am no longer one because I was working as a field biologist for the state government, when I was incarcerated for nearly a decade for something I didn't do. It would have been longer than a decade, but I won my appeal to show the judge had been biased and that I couldn't have been convicted if I had been allowed to admit evidence that showed I was not guilty. So I was let out with a "so sorry" and what amounted to a shove.

Wow, man. Sorry you had to go through something like that.

[Pat Mustard]

I would not discard the Christian bible as a storybook.
In regards to using the search function before declaring a paucity for evolution (had to get my dictionary out on that one), I was looking for some conversation on a Saturday night and not merely browsing the forum.  

Pete

On the bible, it is a storybook. Even a cursory investigation of its contents will reveal that it's mostly mythology (there was no garden of eden, there was no exodus from Egypt, there was no unified kingdom, &c ad nauseum)with no basis in reality.

Regarding me telling you to look up what was previously shown to support evolution, there have been a lot of people that made the same idiotic statement you did, viz that evolution has little to no evidence for it both here and elsewhere, and every single one of them has been thoroughly refuted. I am tired of the same old stupidity rearing its ugly head every few weeks, by people who think they're making a gotcha argument.

[TheRocketSurgeon]

Oh, and I should point out that there's a valid reason behind the hostility you faced. We have several Creationist posters who like to come here and "just ask questions", playing a sort of coy game in which they engage in passive-aggressive tactics and denial of their actual motives for questioning, trying to "bait" us into saying something they can leap upon and build a straw-man argument out of. It happens almost weekly that we get a new example of this type of personality (often, it's the same people "making a sock", by pretending to be a new user, which is why people here said talking "like a sock of a previously perma-banned user" was a bad idea). You appear to be genuinely new and to not share that desire to try to verbally manipulate us. That being the case, I'd ask the other users here to go more gently with you.

Hope you like it here.

[PETE_ROSE]

Wow, I can't fathom how being incarcerated under those circumstances must feel. I am sorry to hear that. Makes any challenging circumstances in my life pale in comparison. I am happy to hear you have found joy in your love of motorcycles. I can definitely relate to that as I owned several in my younger years. I sold my last GSXR 600 when I came home from Iraq and my son was born. Seemed like too much of a chance I was taking with the near misses and unobservant drivers. No one looks out for motorcyclists. I do look forward to retirement years annd after my children are grown to the possibility of riding again. Cruising the Grand Canyon and the Dragons Tail in TN are two things I never did check off on my MC bucket list

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I assure you that I am a new user. I am gaining an understanding of the lay of the land here. I am disappointed in the attitude and tactics used by Christians as well as others here. I have only been involved in a couple of on line forums ever. A heavy equipment site where we talk about bulldozers and such and for many years I was a member in a sports gambling forum called FreeWinners under the same username I have here. I have since stopped "sports investing" as I always called it. Not really for religious views but mainly to study the investment markets and that I finaly realized I wasnt good at it.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

My question for someone with your background would be your thoughts on the fossil record as it relates to evolution. It is my understanding that the fossil record does not support evolution in the sense that there are few, if any, fossils of transitional species. Examples of fish evolving into land animals and such. That the record shows several periods of many new species emerging, but nothing that would show evolving from one species to another.

Erm...if new species emerge, where do they come from if not evolved from other species? And could you point out an instance of 'fish evolving into land animals' where they are NOT different species?

Boru