Transgendered children

[Amarok]

I'm just wondering, genuine question I'm not "judging" anyone I'm just curious to know, have there been many studies done on the effects hormone blockers might have on brain development at puberty?  

I'm sure the gender therapy doctors know more than all of us, but I just can't imagine it's that healthy and harmless, considering the stuff your head goes through as a teenager already without hormones.

I suppose time will tell as the first kids to try it get older.

Yup there has been some . Can't say them off the top of my head (was for a case  2 years ago ) .But as far as I know side effect are rare. And nothing I know of that isn't reversible when you stop taking them .Teenage brains are pretty resilient.

[paulpablo]

I'm just wondering, genuine question I'm not "judging" anyone I'm just curious to know, have there been many studies done on the effects hormone blockers might have on brain development at puberty?  

I'm sure the gender therapy doctors know more than all of us, but I just can't imagine it's that healthy and harmless, considering the stuff your head goes through as a teenager already without hormones.

I suppose time will tell as the first kids to try it get older.

That's a bit mixed up, in the sense that the stuff that goes through your head in puberty is because of the hormones, it's not without the hormones.  A child going through puberty with hormone blockers would be the one without the hormones I imagine.  Just judging by the fact they're called hormone blockers, not that I know much about them.

But I'd be skeptical about if their use is healthy even with a medical approval.

I wouldn't shun medical intervention when it's reasonably useful but I don't think even medical professionals fully understand the intricate mechanisms and how everything effects everything else in the body totally.
It only takes a few decades sometimes for medical opinion to flip flop on ideas and I tend to think sticking as close to nature as you can is a pretty good idea a lot of the time.

I've thought about trying out steroids before but I don't like the idea of manipulating nature to the extent of messing around with hormones.  

Unless it's a situation where I as a man somehow started growing tits or something.  Then I'd say yeh do whatever you have to do with hormones to stop this.

[account_inactive]

Bella? 

I know of a Blaire White I could turn you onto if you want to listen to right wing talking points, and want to hear it straight from another damn tranny

I like Blaire as well, don't always agree with her on everything though.

[Amarok]

Yup once the word Cuck is used I know I'm dealing with a rightwing fringaloon

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Blaire White the less I sat about her/him the better

[Mirek-Polska]

Opinions? I find this disturbing in many ways and quite frankly don't know what to think about it. Tell me what you think.

The little boy who started a sex change aged eight because he (and his lesbian parents) knew he always wanted to be a girl

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...tment.html

I am a very religions person. I am an active member of the church in my community. I must say, I disagree when I hear the people of my congregation talking badly about Transgender people at all. I support them. I think that maybe if they are very young, that the ideas could be a phase. However, if parents are truly sure that their child needs a change, or if the person is old enough to think for themselves, I am all for it. I got to get out of Poland and move to a more progressive nation like Sweden or Germany

[Violet]

Ooh, you're even using "cuck" now.  Your induction into simple-minded, teenage internet politics is complete.

You don't believe in chemtrails?  Goddamn commie.  Next you'll be telling me that climate change is man-made, the Denver airport isn't a hub for the New World Order and the government can't actually steer tornadoes with their super-secret technology.

It's an absolutely wonderful word, of course I'm usin it

If the government could steer tornadoes: why not actively use the technology? I'm not gonna lie to you about global warming, tho

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I like Blaire as well, don't always agree with her on everything though.

So you're Bella! Nice to meat you ^_^

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Yup once the word Cuck is used I know I'm dealing with a rightwing fringaloon

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Blaire White the less I sat about her/him the better

That'd be a 'her', Orochi. 

What's an attractive woman with an easy C cup gotta do for a little recognition 'round here? 

[account_inactive]

So you're Bella! Nice to meat you ^_^

Nice to meet you too!  

[Alex K]

I know of a Blaire White I could turn you onto if you want to listen to right wing talking points, and want to hear it straight from another damn tranny

I get my right wing talking points exclusively from "trannies", it seems. Odd.

[Violet]

That's a bit mixed up, in the sense that the stuff that goes through your head in puberty is because of the hormones, it's not without the hormones.  A child going through puberty with hormone blockers would be the one without the hormones I imagine.  Just judging by the fact they're called hormone blockers, not that I know much about them.

But I'd be skeptical about if their use is healthy even with a medical approval.

It's not just hormone blockers (which don't always get given to transmen (testosterone is magic) but always are given to transwomen (testosterone is black magic)), it's trickle levels of the alternative hormone that slowly ramp up and do their best to simulate the desired puberty.

But some people are very impatient. I'm one of those people... but then, I had tried to do things the right way before I was defacto locked out (not a high population, alaska). It's probably cost me hugely in terms of the size of my knockers... but at this point I couldn't go back to that level to 'properly' grow them afaik, and given some pains I've had lately: either they haven't given up on me yet, or I've got cancer

Regarding the hormone blockers that transwomen use: they're not wholly safe. That is... used as anything more than a stopgap measure can easily end in cancer, life-threatening skin conditions, liver failure, blood clots, etc. In the amounts of these pills required for the treatment of transsexual women comes an elevated risk level... while it is possible to jump from one hormone blocker to another if the person needs more time: it's absolutely the inferior approach to the surgery that has relatively few complications (baring utter laziness and a total lack of self care, and that's just nature's course in healing what it sees as an open wound), and it subjects the patient to the various side effects that come with the new drug.

Let me tell you, I can't wait to stop taking Spiro later this year entirely for its 'benign' side effects (nausea, insane thirst, pissing more often (i'm taking 400 mg of a diuretic every day ). They're just annoying enough that "I'd rather chop off my balls and die" As it were...

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I get my right wing talking points exclusively from "trannies", it seems. Odd.

That's a shame, in that case you should really expand your horizons. You'll never know what you're missing (that hilarious podcast, you gotta).

I just think it's one of those interesting things. Like the people calling Milo Y a Nazi. Just... unusual, and a little bit interesting

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I am a very religions person. I am an active member of the church in my community. I must say, I disagree when I hear the people of my congregation talking badly about Transgender people at all. I support them. I think that maybe if they are very young, that the ideas could be a phase. However, if parents are truly sure that their child needs a change, or if the person is old enough to think for themselves, I am all for it. I got to get out of Poland and move to a more progressive nation like Sweden or Germany

If you ever do, please don't go out at night alone. While we don't fully agree in every way, I'm still grateful for your support of us, and I appreciate your opinion

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Yup  there has been some . Can't say them off the top of my head (was for a case  2 years ago ) .But as far as I know  side effect are rare. And nothing I know of that isn't reversible when you stop taking them .Teenage brains are pretty resilient.

B-b-boooooooobs, Orochi. Gotta stop inside that first month, and hell: mine were definitely starting inside the first two weeks. They'll have little (or... not, quite as little) boobs for the rest of their life.

And if a female takes T? They're gonna feel some abject misery with themselves if they aren't actually a man in a woman's body. Kind of on level with what transwomen just get to feel by default. Really messes with the suicide rate imo.

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I'm sorry; when did children start having their genitals removed as a result of their transgendered-ness?

Also, last I checked, parents weren't allowing their children to take hormones, but hormone blockers which basically just delay puberty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Money...vid_Reimer

Money claimed that media response to the exposé was due to right-wing media bias and "the antifeminist movement". He claimed his detractors believed "masculinity and femininity are built into the genes so women should get back to the mattress and the kitchen".[21] However, intersex activists also criticized Money, stating that the unreported failure had led to the surgical reassignment of thousands of infants as a matter of policy.[22] Privately, Money was mortified by the case, colleagues said, and as a rule did not discuss it.[23] Money's own views also developed and changed over the years.[1][24]

Expose noted below:

https://web.archive.org/web/200008150956...hnjoan.htm

In 1967, an anonymous baby boy was turned into a girl by doctors at Johns Hopkins Hospital. For 25 years, the case of John/Joan was called a medical triumph — proof that a child’s gender identity could be changed — and thousands of “sex reassignments” were performed based on this example

Thousands. Never mind the highly suspectable pedophilia of John Money, it's gross too, but it's beside the point. 

http://www.isna.org/articles/ambivalent_medicine

Republished with kind permission from The Hastings Center Report May/Jun 1998, Volume 28, Issue 3 Pages 24-35.

Subject terms: “Medical ethics,” Surgery, Sexes, Reproductive system, Child development, Babies

Abstract

Ethical issues in the treatment of intersexuality are examined. It is not at all clear if all or even most of the intersex surgeries done today involve what would legally and ethically constitute informed consent.
Copyright © The Hastings Center May/Jun 1998

There's a reason I'm furious... it's precedent, and the ever-flirtation science has always had with going out of bounds. As for cases of sexual reassignment surgery apportioned for explicitly gender identity reasons, you're mostly right in that it's widely regarded as unethical (even insane) to perform on a minor (treatment of intersex sufferers is far less horrifying these days, and circumcisions themselves are a barbaric practice that falls ever out of favor (would it could be illegal for any but an adult independently deciding to.. I literally didn't understand or care when it was suggested to and then performed on me when I was 11 (12?), as I didn't associate with my penis much even prior to my self-recognition (not that there was a lot of foreskin... but I'd rather have had it for my future surgery than not, and people wonder why there's so much rage inbuilt in me  )))... there are rules in place that are not child's play to bend to perform it on children (of course, the child could always force their hand and mandate it by genital mutilation, but then it'd mess with the integrity of the desired genitals (very annoying, why I never did it))... however, some cases do still happen:

http://archive.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2010/01/12/spanish_teen_undergoes_sex_change/

MADRID—A 16-year-old Spaniard has had a sex change operation, becoming the country's first minor to undergo a procedure that few countries in the world allow for people so young, a doctor said Tuesday.


The two-and-a-half hour surgery was performed in Barcelona three weeks ago and the patient is doing fine, reconstructive surgeon Ivan Manero, who did the surgery, told a news conference in Spain's second largest city.

Manero said the patient had been undergoing hormonal and psychiatric treatment for two years, after deciding he wanted to undergo surgery to have the body of a woman. The boy "said he felt like a woman from the age of four or five," Manero said. The patient's name has not been disclosed.
The surgery was authorized by a judge, as required by Spanish law for minors seeking such an operation.

It takes a legal case brought forward in addition to all the other >necessary< hassles.

As an aside not related to the genetalia dealie much: but damn... we're down to 4 now... O__o

https://au.news.yahoo.com/nsw/a/32501729...ent/#page1

[Violet]

You make a good point about being checked out by many doctors of different specializations in order to properly diagnosis the condition. Which can be expensive and not covered by most HMO'S or PPO'S. Disagree with me all you want, but I don't think these cost should be covered by tax payers. If you have private insurance then it be up to the company if they cover such services. Besides that though, when you hear about these stories of a nine year old, or a eleven year old getting hormonal treatment. It's really messed up, these children have not even hit puberty yet. It's not my call to make, parents have the options to raise their children as they like. I do disagree with going that option so early in life. I would say at least wait until the age of sixteen to start any type of treatment in regards to hormone therapy.

Why would I ever disagree with that?! I sure as HELL don't want anyone else paying for this crap... sure, it's probably injust that I've got to deal with it in the first place, and sure, I won't be able to work for at least 6 months (which is fine in my specific case, but I can see how it'd be a problem for others)... but with a little bit of intelligent fiscal planning I believe it can and should be done by the person suffering (or those who immediately support them). I mean... family has become so fucking meaningless with this shove towards its dissolution with welfare I don't want your money, and I don't want to lose 2000 dollars a year of my paycheck on a stupid insurance scam that has never done me any favors!

I really miss buying my medicines for 400 fewer dollars than what they tack onto my damn healthcare stupidity every month... our socialized healthcare where the government pocket is limitless and businesses know it has cause out-of-control rises for service if I want to get off of the government teet (I do). Something really has to be done, it's completely unacceptable (and to try and fucking tax me for not being on it?! Fucking shame!!). Little digression there... back to the meat:

I might argue down to 14 myself, but I couldn't see going too much lower than that. Puberty has a great degree of potential to change a personality, and the introduction of sexual interest in people allows for us to know pretty close to for certain (ya wanna pork or ya wanna get porked? )

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I'm just wondering, genuine question I'm not "judging" anyone I'm just curious to know, have there been many studies done on the effects hormone blockers might have on brain development at puberty?  

I'm sure the gender therapy doctors know more than all of us, but I just can't imagine it's that healthy and harmless, considering the stuff your head goes through as a teenager already without hormones.

I suppose time will tell as the first kids to try it get older.

It's one of the biggest problems I have with treating transgendered people: there are huge holes in the science, and we cannot state for certain exactly what causes transsexualism in the first place. We need way more information than we have.

Right now, I say we need to be very careful with how far back we push... there's been too much harm done in the name of expediting medical care without full grasp of the cause in otherwise nonlethal cases. If transtrenders are anything to go by: we're gonna be seeing a shit ton of hormonally fluctuating trans-wannabes over the next few years. I know a couple of people myself who've started and stopped hormones after a few years... if adults can be that fucking indecisive and crazy, then how fucking kooky could a kid get?