What's wrong with Woke

[Divinity]

People who complain about "Wokeness" are all shitty people who don't want to be shit on for their shitty ideas.  You'll notice people attack 'wokeness' because they are small minded neanderthals who can't handle anything different than them. This particularly includes having different beliefs. It's almost ironic, given how they want their beliefs to be respected and bitch about 'cancel culture' but then try to cancel people and refuse to respect any beliefs but their own.

I'm not interested in canceling anyone. But I will call out intellectually backwards opinions when I see them.

You make the mistake of assuming yourself to be intelligent enough to recognize what's 'intellecually backwards'. You do not. Your lot will gladly cancel gay and black authors, banning their books from schools, because it threatens your fragile bubble where you can treat people like shit. And dont' give me none of this "But I'm gay!" bullshit. You may be gay, so is Milo Yiannopoulos. And he's still a shithead who promotes conversion therapy.

[Peebothuhlu]

At work.

People who complain about "Wokeness" are all shitty people who don't want to be shit on for their shitty ideas.  You'll notice people attack 'wokeness' because they are small minded neanderthals who can't handle anything different than them. This particularly includes having different beliefs. It's almost ironic, given how they want their beliefs to be respected and bitch about 'cancel culture' but then try to cancel people and refuse to respect any beliefs but their own.

I'm not interested in canceling anyone. But I will call out intellectually backwards opinions when I see them.

*Reads Ahriman's post....... *

Really?

You just have absolutely no self awareness or introspection, do you Ahriman?

I think a 'Elisa' program would behave with better replies than that.

[no one]

Just think like me, I know what's right.

[Irreligious Atheist]

Woke has many different meanings. I consider myself to be pretty woke, AKA red pilled about how the world works. There is the matrix meaning of woke. And then there are the 9/11 truthers who always called themselves awake and pretty much owned that term for a long while. There is the black community who has used the word woke for a long while, meaning that they consider themselves informed about social justice issues. And then there is more of the newer woke, which has become a putdown, and rightfully so, directed at people like Anita Sarkeesian, who described becoming a feminist as "Everything is racist, everything is sexist, everything is homophobic, and you have to point it all out." This is what the sensible among us reject. Yes, there is plenty of racism, sexism and homophobia in the world, but not every literal thing is racist, sexist and homophobic.

I used to be a bit of an SJW myself for a number of years, calling people out for saying the wrong thing, but SJW, to me at least, came to mean that a great deal of these people want you censored and maybe even charged with hate speech (in 2015, 40 % of millennials wanted to abolish free speech. I'm sure things have only gotten worse since then https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/20...inorities/) . Nowadays, I use the terms SJW or wokeist interchangeably with authoritarian or fascist.

[brewer]

Short answer:

First problem: Woke condemnation is often taken to far.

Second problem: People claim unfair woke condemnation when condemnation is appropriate.

[Brian37]

If I call Bin Laden a "terrorist" there would not be many people on the left or right that would disagree.

But my best friend from Oklahoma is a "redneck". The left often associates trailer dwellers and the middle of the country as uneducated MAGA supporters. HB(Hillbilly Atheist) speaks with the typical twang, uses words like "taters" instead of potato. He literally wears cowboy hats and has a belt buckle he uses for his I.D. He is one of the  biggest liberals and smartest people I know. 

He hates it when " the left" uses the word "redneck" as a slur. I get it. But at the same time, he knows me well enough when I use the same word, I am making fun of the bigots not sporting them

I have a friend from Pakistan, and he constantly loves to blame (tease) white people for everything that happens in the east. Conversely I love to tease him by calling him an Arab  even though he is from Pakistan. 

Point is if the humor is done out of love, friendship I think it is ok. But most people can, our should be able to tell, when someone is simply ribbing you and when they truly hate you.

I think it is a moral absolute to fight bigotry on all fronts. But at the same time, among friends we should be able to know the difference between hate speech and having a friendly tease.

[tackattack]

People who complain about "Wokeness" are all shitty people who don't want to be shit on for their shitty ideas.  You'll notice people attack 'wokeness' because they are small minded neanderthals who can't handle anything different than them. This particularly includes having different beliefs. It's almost ironic, given how they want their beliefs to be respected and bitch about 'cancel culture' but then try to cancel people and refuse to respect any beliefs but their own.

I'm not interested in canceling anyone. But I will call out intellectually backwards opinions when I see them.

So calling out bad opinions with your opinion.... that seems like the definition of woke to me. What makes your opinion not bad? how is it productive to call out bad opinions with your own bad opinion? If your opinion is just right to you, then you're calling out an opinion other than yours that you consider bad with an opinion of yours that you consider good. That's called free speech and you have every right to be wrong.. completely wrong, misinformed and ignorant. It is when you use that opinion that is only right to you... to socially hurt others that it becomes toxic. So let's up the scale.. 

Now you have a public opinion that your small group determines is bad, and you call it out as a small group that agrees it's bad in their opinion. This has exponential more social pressure on the singular originator of the "bad opinion". It could also be just as "wrong", misinformed or ignorant at the group level.

This is why there is a societal norm enforced by laws, IMO. Example, A lot of people thought that Jan 6 was the right thing to do, spurred by emotionalism, misinformation, fear and ignorance. Even as a group they thought it was right. Bad actors used the opportunity to kill and injure people. They were "cancelled" by the larger groups perception that it was insurrection, rather than demonstration. This was solidified by a follow up prosecution. 

This means that public opinion of the majority does seem to have a containing effect on wokeness. In the age of misinformation (much like the show jock era for radio) this could be problematic... which is perhaps why the perception that wokeness is going around unbridled exploding.

/2cents

[Spongebob]

At work.



Neither?

 Perchance it's a good 'Social norm' to question the behaviour of the courts and legal system when it comes to who, how and why people are/aren't convicted and aquitted?

 Sorry, I'm not that 'Up' on foreign affairs like disgraced American sports 'Stars'.

 

Well, you can choose any example you like.  I'm just not sure why calling out bad people is related to either social construct.  As I pointed out before, we do this in small communities all the time.  This happens in the workplace, too and it happens in churches.  It appears to be a natural thing that humans do to keep others in line with social norms, yet when it happens on a large scale we get a segment of the population that believes it is unfair.  Why?

[Anomalocaris]

Yes, it is absolutely wrong. End of story. If you don't think so, how about we cancel you and see how you like it?

Yeah, cancel culture is so inadequate.  Some people should have been canceled before birth,  in fact should have been cancelled several generations before birth,

[HappySkeptic]

Well, you can choose any example you like.  I'm just not sure why calling out bad people is related to either social construct.  As I pointed out before, we do this in small communities all the time.  This happens in the workplace, too and it happens in churches.  It appears to be a natural thing that humans do to keep others in line with social norms, yet when it happens on a large scale we get a segment of the population that believes it is unfair.  Why?

I don't like cancel culture. Imagine if your every action were to be scrutinized by the internet, and the first time you do or say something that doesn't meet a purity test, people actively try to destroy your life.

In real life, bad behavior can be called out by the people who it actually affects. In cancel culture, it is called out by people who it doesn't affect. The average Joe is judge, jury and executioner. There is no room for tolerance or a different life experience.

Cancel culture is no different than the intolerance of religious zealots.