Russia and Ukraine

[The Grand Nudger]

No one backed Russia into invading Ukraine…but Russia.

[Anomalocaris]

No one backed Russia into invading Ukraine…but Russia.

The US did, with her effort to install western oriented politicians during color revolution, open declaration to put ukraine on path to joining NATO, euromaiden revolution, etc.   Any effort to reduce russia’s sway over ukraine and make her access to and control over black sea more tenuous will eventually result in forceful pushback unless russia manages to reverse the effort without war, as indeed Russia had tried to do since about 2001 and repeatedly failed.  for russia it was always that no method, up to and including use of nuclear weapon, is off limits to ensure it maintain its sway over ukraine abs black sea over foreign efforts to push her back into being a essentially inland steppe state. 

If russia really is going to lose in Ukraine conventionally, I believe Putin will go nuclear.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I have something even less emotional and more coolly thoughtful still for you:

Go fuck yourself.

[Thumpalumpacus]

No one backed Russia into invading Ukraine…but Russia.

The US did, with her effort to install western oriented politicians during color revolution, open declaration to put ukraine on path to joining NATO, euromaiden revolution, etc.  

Damn, and you were sounding pretty smart with all those "fucks".

[The Grand Nudger]

The US, nor anyone else, did anything of the sort. If it's true that Putin will go nuclear, and that Russia would actually carry out that order - that...too..will have been entirely elective on Russia's part.

[Thumpalumpacus]

KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — A Russian soldier who pleaded guilty to killing a civilian was sentenced by a Ukrainian court Monday to life in prison — the maximum — amid signs the Kremlin may hold trials of its own, particularly of the captured fighters who held out at Mariupol’s steel plant.

Meanwhile, in a rare public expression of opposition to the war from the ranks of the Russian elite, a veteran Kremlin diplomat resigned and sent a scathing letter to foreign colleagues in which he said of the invasion, “Never have I been so ashamed of my country as on Feb. 24 of this year.”

[...]

And on the battlefield, heavy fighting raged in the Donbas in the east, where Moscow’s forces have stepped up their bombardments. Cities not under Russian control were constantly shelled, and one Ukrainian military official said Russian forces targeted civilians trying to flee.

https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukrain...4367807335

[Anomalocaris]

The US, nor anyone else, did anything of the sort.  If it's true that Putin will go nuclear, and that Russia would actually carry out that order - that...too..will have been entirely elective on Russia's part.

of course any power can elect to allow its core interests to be overridden and its influences curtailed.   Russia did not choose to so elect.

Neither did the US, nor had ever done the US, although if the US at any expected its course of action since 2001 would not arrive at the present situation in Ukraine, then the US has clearly believes russia is a nation made of less domineering stuff than ourself and would so elect, hence the conflict now.

[Pat Mustard]

How significant is Russia’s invasion? It has made the Swiss - the Swiss - re-visit their policy of neutrality. Not to the extent of joining NATO, but they’re considering working more closely with the alliance, even to the extent of backfilling munitions sent to Ukraine by NATO members.

That Switzerland is even considering this is an indication of how badly Putin read the room.

Boru

This is definitely the biggest blunder of his career. It's mystifying how someone raised on spycraft should have such poor insight.

The iron law of dictatorships is that they always descend to delusion, happened with Hitler and Mussolini, happened with the Soviets, happened to Mao and again to Xi and so on all the way back through the annals of history. About the only time in history where dictatorship has worked has been with Cincinnatus (and that's largely doubted by historians).

[The Grand Nudger]

A TQ is an explicit admission that someone's point is factually accurate. Russia (or, at least four or five people in russia....) may think that military belligerence and territorial expansion is in it's best interests. That's on them, right or wrong....not the US or anyone else.

[The Grand Nudger]

This is definitely the biggest blunder of his career. It's mystifying how someone raised on spycraft should have such poor insight.

The iron law of dictatorships is that they always descend to delusion, happened with Hitler and Mussolini, happened with the Soviets, happened to Mao and again to Xi and so on all the way back through the annals of history.  About the only time in history where dictatorship has worked has been with Cincinnatus (and that's largely doubted by historians).

-because the strengths and weaknesses of a state are reduced to the strengths and weaknesses (and moods...lol) of a single person. Had a bad plate of shrimp, decided to invade a neighboring state with too few troops, shitty equipment, and no logistical support? Oh well, sucks to be all of the other people of [insert both states here].