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(March 21, 2012 at 12:21 am)aleialoura Wrote: I would rather marry my cat than a disgusting freak of fucking nature, such as a homophobe. After all, a cat is just a cat and can't help it. It was born a cat. Homophobes are born human but choose to adhere to vile and warped ideals, as opposed to humanistic ones.
Not only that, but if you get tired of the marriage after 7 years or so, you don't have to wait too long for the cat to die.
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
March 21, 2012 at 4:03 pm (This post was last modified: March 21, 2012 at 4:03 pm by Faith No More.)
StatCrux Wrote:...but calling it marriage is to diminish the sacrament of marriage.
I'm always amazed when homophobes trot out this argument. In a world where people go on reality tv to pick a spouse and marriage cerermonies are performed in drive-thru wedding chapels they are worried about two people of the same gender that love each other ruining the sacrament of marriage. It's just another one of those diversionary tactics they are so fond of.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
March 21, 2012 at 4:57 pm (This post was last modified: March 21, 2012 at 4:58 pm by passionatefool.)
(March 21, 2012 at 2:29 am)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:
(March 20, 2012 at 7:56 pm)passionatefool Wrote:
(March 20, 2012 at 7:25 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote:
(March 20, 2012 at 7:07 pm)passionatefool Wrote: Omfg who the fuck Get married in a church?! Especially when it is against it. I dont give a shit about the church and i am sure nobody is carrying some agenda to destroy those stupid churches.
PF -
Part of what's at issue here is that there are churches in the UK who aren't opposed to same-sex marriage, but are prevented by law from performing such ceremonies. Apparently some would like to keep it that way.
As much as I am opposed to religion in general, I'm not going to oppose them when they're trying to do the right thing.
I'm just responding to the thread starter, he/she asked if the church should be forced to perform the ceremonies or not and go on accusing people or the gays of carrying out some agenda or conspiracy to attack some church as if people really give a crap about that, if I want to attack it I would have better reason. This is just stupid and irrelevant. Churches are private organization so if they dont want to perform it then they shouldn't have to, and if they want to, then they should be able to, and if people dont want to get married in a church at all then idk do it at a strip club or something. Same Sex marriage should only be an issue when it is not recognized under the law. Other issues concerning the ceremonies should be up to the church and the individuals. I didn't read anything else so I don't know what you are referring to.
My mistake, I assumed you were following the thread. FWIW, I completely agree.
sorry, I wasnt awared of how far the discussion had gotten until after I posted the response without quoting the topic starter so it wasnt clear who I was responding to.
(March 19, 2012 at 8:37 am)Tiberius Wrote: Nobody should be forced to marry two people if it goes against their beliefs. Ultimately, this is why I am favour of government getting out of the marriage business. They have no right to tell any two consenting people that they cannot marry. Marriage is what you decide it is, not the commercial and statist thing it has become.
I agree completely. The government needs to remove itself from the marriage issue completely. Its funny that the right wingers in the US rail against government control over people's lives but then on this issue here they are trying pass nationwide bans and rewrite the constitution.
The real hidden agenda her is that conservatives will not stop until they have effectively written their moral beliefs into policy. They don't believe in populism and democracy they believe they have ultimate truth and their duty is to enact it via policy. That is essentially what is happening now with the contraception issue. The conservatives will not stop until they can categorically deny birth control coverage.
"A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything." -Friedrich Nietzsche
"All thinking men are atheists." -Ernest Hemmingway
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." -Voltaire
March 23, 2012 at 11:41 am (This post was last modified: March 23, 2012 at 11:42 am by Ben Davis.)
As is often the case with LGBT issues, they're not as simple as the religious opponents of equal rights would have you believe. This is not just about homo vs hetero sexual rights but a matter that all people must be treated equally by the law irrespective of their sexuality. Lets look at a couple of hypothetical situations to make the 'grey' areas a little less obscure:
1. Imagine a bisexual person who's a member of an abrahamic church. This person is consciously aware of their sexuality. This person falls in love with someone of the opposite sex, gets married, has children and unfortunately gets divorced. Then they fall in love with someone of the same sex. It's ethically unsupportable to deny this person access to exactly the same rights they enjoyed under exactly the same circumstances when nothing about them has changed other than their partner.
2. Imagine a heterosexual person who's a member of an abrahamic church. This person falls in love with someone of the opposite sex, gets married, has children but decides to have a sex change (which their partner is comfortable with). It's ethically unsupportable to deny this person the rights for which they are already qualified when nothing has changed about them other than their body imagery
These are perfect examples of why the OP is nothing more than bluster when faced with the ideal of equal rights.
Today the UK government has backed down on the gay marriage agenda, a triumph of reason and understanding of the moral majority! We should not be dictated to by minority groups! The first intelligent thing this government has done!
(May 13, 2012 at 4:51 am)StatCrux Wrote: Today the UK government has backed down on the gay marriage agenda, a triumph of reason and understanding of the moral majority! We should not be dictated to by minority groups! The first intelligent thing this government has done!
Majority does not equal the right thing like: eat shit, 12trn flies can't be wrong. I am sad by this, but it is a minor set back.
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" - Edward Gibbon (Offen misattributed to Lucius Annaeus Seneca or Seneca the Younger) (Thanks to apophenia for the correction)
'I am driven by two main philosophies:
Know more about the world than I knew yesterday and lessen the suffering of others. You'd be surprised how far that gets you' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
Quote:Today the UK government has backed down on the gay marriage agenda, a triumph of reason and understanding of the moral majority!
It is a triumph of short-term political expediency. Long term, legalised gay marriage WILL happen.Such an event seems logically inevitable in any country in which homosexual acts are legal.
On the sacrament of marriage.
The seven sacraments are rituals invented by the church and are meaningless to non Christians. Marriage is not now and has never been a religious ceremony.Marriage is a civil contract between twp people.The Church blesses/sanctifies the marriages of believers,the church does NOT perform marriages. A marriage occurs in fact when the two people involved say it does. .Legal recognition is another matter; the FACT of a marriage must be registered under the conditions of specific law(s). Currently this is not possible for same sex couples in most countries.
(May 13, 2012 at 4:51 am)StatCrux Wrote: Today the UK government has backed down on the gay marriage agenda, a triumph of reason and understanding of the moral majority! We should not be dictated to by minority groups! The first intelligent thing this government has done!
Majority does not equal the right thing like: eat shit, 12trn flies can't be wrong. I am sad by this, but it is a minor set back.
That's interesting...how do you define "the right thing" regarding moral issues then? If not by majority of opinion? Are you saying that there is an objective "right thing" independent of majority opinion?
