Posts: 3226
Threads: 244
Joined: April 17, 2012
Reputation:
54
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 8:38 pm
(April 24, 2012 at 8:30 pm)padraic Wrote: Quote:I mean there are 365 prophecies of Jesus recorded in the Old Testament
Actually,"Jesus" is a Roman,not a Hebrew name and is not mentioned once. Nor,as far as I'm aware is the name Yeshua/Yoshua bar Yosuf .
Nor did Jesus come close to fulfilling prophecy for the Messiah, beginning with: The Messiah is to be a military as well a spiritual leader,in the Davidic tradition. It is emphatically stated that the Messiah is to be to normal man and most definitely NOT DIVINE.
So far,I have yet to see ANY credible evidence for any kind of precogintion,fortune telling or prophecy. The Christian claims that Jesus met messianic are farcical and I believe essentially dishonest.
....
If I remember correctly, Christians just say that the remaining prophecies not fulfilled will be fulfilled during Jesus 2: Hellfire Boogaloo otherwise known as the second coming.
My ignore list
"The lord doesn't work in mysterious ways, but in ways that are indistinguishable from his nonexistence."
-- George Yorgo Veenhuyzen quoted by John W. Loftus in The End of Christianity (p. 103).
Posts: 30974
Threads: 204
Joined: July 19, 2011
Reputation:
141
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 9:08 pm
(April 24, 2012 at 8:38 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: If I remember correctly, Christians just say that the remaining prophecies not fulfilled will be fulfilled during Jesus 2: Hellfire Boogaloo otherwise known as the second coming.
How convenient for them.
Posts: 69247
Threads: 3759
Joined: August 2, 2009
Reputation:
259
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 10:00 pm
Quote:Ron Wyatt claimed he discovered the blood of Jesus
Ron Wyatt claimed lots of things. He was a charlatan of the first order and the kind of guy who always finds easy pickings among stupid theists.
"A fool and his money are soon parted" is mainly about xtians.
Some of those alleged "prophecies" don't stand up to close scrutiny. Some never existed at all...but that doesn't stop idiots from accepting them.
Posts: 3226
Threads: 244
Joined: April 17, 2012
Reputation:
54
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 11:00 pm
(April 24, 2012 at 9:08 pm)Cthulhu Dreaming Wrote: (April 24, 2012 at 8:38 pm)teaearlgreyhot Wrote: If I remember correctly, Christians just say that the remaining prophecies not fulfilled will be fulfilled during Jesus 2: Hellfire Boogaloo otherwise known as the second coming.
How convenient for them.
There's also within Christianity the "Dispensational" theology. It's very popular but last I checked it's starting to wane. It basically teaches that there's different "ages" or "dispensations" in human history. In these dispensations, God acts differently to mankind for different reasons, thus explaining why in some parts of the Bible, he's a mass murderer, and in other parts, he's Barney the big purple dinosaur. Right now, we're in the dispensation of "Grace." I can't remember what the other's are but there's at least 6 or 7 of them.
What's peculiar about Dispensationalism is if I understood it right, it says that the end of the world could have actually happened in during Jesus' first coming in Israel. Basically, Jesus originally came the first time to Earth to bring his kingdom, but the problem was the Jews, his own people, rejected him, so he couldn't establish the kingdom. Sooooo, he then resorted to Plan B, which was dying on cross to save all mankind, and delayed the coming of the kingdom for 2000 plus years. So those, prophecies in the OT are thought to have been originally talking about his 1st coming, but since the Jews betrayed him, they're now going to be about his 2nd coming. This is what I remember from my brief study of Dispensationalism. I never understood it completely so if someone was/is more better knowing of it than I am feel free to correct.
My ignore list
"The lord doesn't work in mysterious ways, but in ways that are indistinguishable from his nonexistence."
-- George Yorgo Veenhuyzen quoted by John W. Loftus in The End of Christianity (p. 103).
Posts: 7388
Threads: 168
Joined: February 25, 2009
Reputation:
45
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 11:12 pm
Quote:Some of those alleged "prophecies" don't stand up to close scrutiny. Some never existed at all...but that doesn't stop idiots from accepting them.
Actually Min some DO stand up-ish. I refer to the prophecies made ex post facto. All the others,not so much (OK,at not all) 
Posts: 67172
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
162
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 11:16 pm
I prefer my prophecies to actually do some prophecy-ing, personally.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 274
Threads: 5
Joined: April 17, 2010
Reputation:
12
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 24, 2012 at 11:36 pm
Jesus was supposed to have lived and died during the reign of Tiberius. There were historians alive during that period, yet none thought to mention a man walking through their town healing the sick and raising the dead. I don't know about you, but I might find that noteworthy.
What we do have are demigod who "lived" before jesus, performed many of the same magic tricks, and died in much the same manner. We have an organization that ruled Europe for 1500 years and did everything in their power to make sure jesus survived the ages. It's a scam, forged and blatantly stolen from the other superheroes of the period and packaged for mass production. Jesus fits a very old mold and if the son of a Jewish carpenters named Jesus actually existed we know nothing about him.
"In our youth, we lacked the maturity, the decency to create gods better than ourselves so that we might have something to aspire to. Instead we are left with a host of deities who were violent, narcissistic, vengeful bullies who reflected our own values. Our gods could have been anything we could imagine, and all we were capable of manifesting were gods who shared the worst of our natures."-Me
"Atheism leaves a man to sense, to philosophy, to natural piety, to laws, to reputation; all of which may be guides to an outward moral virtue, even if religion vanished; but religious superstition dismounts all these and erects an absolute monarchy in the minds of men." – Francis Bacon
Posts: 69247
Threads: 3759
Joined: August 2, 2009
Reputation:
259
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 25, 2012 at 12:24 am
(April 24, 2012 at 11:12 pm)padraic Wrote: Quote:Some of those alleged "prophecies" don't stand up to close scrutiny. Some never existed at all...but that doesn't stop idiots from accepting them.
Actually Min some DO stand up-ish. I refer to the prophecies made ex post facto. All the others,not so much (OK,at not all)
An ex post facto "prophecy" is called "history."
Posts: 118
Threads: 10
Joined: April 13, 2012
Reputation:
0
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 28, 2012 at 8:19 pm
(This post was last modified: April 28, 2012 at 8:46 pm by Alter2Ego.)
(April 14, 2012 at 12:29 am)Cinjin Wrote: (April 13, 2012 at 11:45 pm)Alter2Ego Wrote: (April 13, 2012 at 8:06 pm)Cinjin Wrote: None of what you present is evidence that would be even considered by a court of law. And speaking of evidence, do you have any to prove your claim that Josephus was apathetic towards Christianity???
Josephus belonged to the religious group called the Pharisees who were responsible for Jesus' death. He never became a Christian.
I'm well aware of the life of Josephus. I'm wondering where you get your information. Many people consider Josephus' work where JC is involved to be counterfeit. You know ... like he didn't even write it.
And much to nobody's surprise, these "many people" who consider Josephus' work on Jesus Christ to be counterfeit are merely speculating. They don't have a shred of evidence to prove what they are saying.
Tell me, since when did speculations equate to evidence?
Posts: 2658
Threads: 121
Joined: March 19, 2012
Reputation:
27
RE: JESUS CHRIST: Myth or Historical Person?
April 28, 2012 at 10:49 pm
Alter2Ego Wrote:And much to nobody's surprise, these "many people" who consider Josephus' work on Jesus Christ to be counterfeit are merely speculating. They don't have a shred of evidence to prove what they are saying.
Tell me, since when did speculations equate to evidence? Since when does an observant Jew confess he was the Messiah and then stay an observant Jew..?
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" ~ Aristotle
|
