Question for Christians

[Darkstar]

How might one be indoctrinated into a belief when the only statement being made by atheism is a lack of belief? Boggles the mind.

I think he means indoctrinated into belief, and overcame it.

[Hoptoad]

Occasional visitor, If I don't respond it doesn't mean I don't want to, It's just the way of it.

Re Darkstars questions.

After I sent my last post, it bugged me a bit, I felt I did not make a clear enough answer.

First you get Grace, contact with the divine, you don't choose it, it chooses you. In my case it was not particularly wanted, OK I asked for it, but I did not expect an answer. Which I promptly rationalised away and forgot about, nonetheless approximately 7 years later I found my self nervously trying to get up the courage to walk in to a church, for the first time with serious intent.
Your choices come later, the last years of the 7, I accepted there was something I couldn't understand happening, so I should do some research. Frankly I ended up knee deep in religions, Wicca to RC, Hindu to Buddhist, etc, etc. Looked at them all with a cynical eye looking for the catch, non fitted especially the one I finally chose. As I was getting nowhere I thought, pick one jump in with both feet see how it goes, I can always leave, but I never did. The only time I had contact with that church previously was when I nicked the vicar's gates, fortunately not the vicar I got to know.


1. You must do good things to warrent eternal life.
2. Accept Jesus and you don't have to do anything else!

The answers both, except you don't get any thing for good works. They are just the product of growth in the spirit. How to explain, it's just like breathing, you just do it, you see a need and fix it. If your not just automatically doing good works, your not growing, your stunted by something.


Now a comment on Rhythm's point.
To state that you don't believe in the existence of god or gods or gods and supernatural forces. Is your choice, your conclusion your personal opinion. That is not a problem, the problems arise when you add therefore or so. For example, I don't believe in God therefore, you who believe must prove your beliefs, or therefore materialism is the only reality, or therefore science is the only answer.

Each of those therefore's should be followed by I believe, your now in believe territory. Belief is dangerous, you have to be careful with belief, I pray you are.

[The Grand Nudger]

"I'm unwilling or unable to provide any support for the reality of my fairy tales so I'm just going to call everything a belief"

It wouldn't matter if someone was interested in conceding such a silly point to you for the sake of argument, you'd still be left holding unsubstantiated beliefs. IOW, your beliefs and the "beliefs" of others are still not equal. But hey, I'll bite, can you find me someone who says "I don't believe in god, therefore materialism is the only reality", or "I don't believe in god, therefore science is the only answer". I'd love to have some fun with a person who thinks that science as an answer follows from "I don't believe in god" or that materialism is somehow dependent on their belief in god. Sounds like two massive non sequiturs to me (but of course your statement sounds like something to me as well).