Why is faith important?

[jstrodel]

And for those who tried faith, and found nothing? When faith is proven demonstrably faulty?

I do not know why some experience more of God than others. It could be due to sin (if I cherished iniquity in my heart, the LORD would not hear me). It could be do to false teachings, and religion.

I do not think that faith is proved demonstrably faulty because people did not get the result that they wanted, or any result that confirmed the experience. God is real, I don't know why some people experience Him more than others. The best way to increase the likelihood that you will experience God is to seek God sincerely on God's own terms, with repentance, and an absolute commitment to a holy life.

If you experienced something, it's not for me to say one way or the other if you did or didn't, but that experience happened to you, and no one else is justified in believing in something that happened to you.

Of course, this is perfectly reasonable, but the fact that many people believe is a form of evidence for the belief, if not proof that it existed. Consider a testimony in a court room. If people simply tell their story, and you don't believe that they are lying, it is reasonble to trust them to a certain degree and seek the matter out deeper.

For instance, what constitutes a miracle for you? These things you've seen, these supposed instances of god's power. What happened?

Here is a few of them. Glad you asked! Would be happy to share more if you are interested, PM me!
http://atheistforums.org/thread-17455.ht...ght=prayer

[Question Mark]

Here is a few of them. Glad you asked! Would be happy to share more if you are interested, PM me!
http://atheistforums.org/thread-17455.ht...ght=prayer

You asked for a car, and you got one? That constitutes a miracle for you?

[jstrodel]

You asked for a car, and you got one? That constitutes a miracle for you?

I asked for a car and two days later someone gave me a car. Well, actually someone else prayed for me that I would get a car. But I have experiences like that all the time.

Someone only asked once. It was not like I was praying and praying and praying to get a car and someone gave it to me. Someone asked that I could get a car and then I received one two days later. Have you ever had someone basically foretell that you would receive a car?

But I have lived like that for years and years, I have had many answered prayers. God showed me images of my entire life and how he judged each situation.

[Minimalist]

He did, but the question is did those in whom He was speaking know their was a seed smaller than a mustard seed? If He said the "teft" seed was the smallest would anyone know what He was talking about

Would have been a chance to enlighten them, wouldn't it? "Hey, you fuckheads...you think a mustard seed is the smallest seed? It isn't, assholes," spaketh jesus the farmer.

so He used their terms.

Once again you make up shit and pretend it answers the question. This search for loopholes to get your fucking god off the hook probably impresses you and the rest of your ilk. I think you are just an asshole who believes everything you are told, Drippy.

God was. But do you think those He was speaking to shared His knowledge?

I don't think your phony godboy existed at all. Try to keep that firmly in mind.

BTW, if your god deliberately misspoke...that makes him a liar. I can see where you'd prefer that to "fool."

[Question Mark]

You asked for a car, and you got one? That constitutes a miracle for you?

I asked for a car and two days later someone gave me a car. Well, actually someone else prayed for me that I would get a car. But I have experiences like that all the time.

Someone only asked once. It was not like I was praying and praying and praying to get a car and someone gave it to me. Someone asked that I could get a car and then I received one two days later. Have you ever had someone basically foretell that you would receive a car?

But I have lived like that for years and years, I have had many answered prayers. God showed me images of my entire life and how he judged each situation.

Kinda makes me wonder if god plays favourites. I mean, did you need that car particularly badly? Surely there's kids in Africa to feed, or Mexican people getting massacred by drug cartels who need saving?

Also getting a car off someone doesn't seem like much of a miracle if you think about it. Getting a flying car, maybe. Or receiving a car with a note on the dashboard saying "Heard your prayer, keep up the good word - Your ever loving Creator,God".
That's kind of in the same league as walking on water and curing people of blindness, if you see where I'm coming from. Getting a car seems a little mundane in comparison. Could be misconstrued by the casual observer as a bit of a coincidence, you know?

[jstrodel]

Kinda makes me wonder if god plays favourites. I mean, did you need that car particularly badly? Surely there's kids in Africa to feed, or Mexican people getting massacred by drug cartels who need saving?

Also getting a car off someone doesn't seem like much of a miracle if you think about it. Getting a flying car, maybe. Or receiving a car with a note on the dashboard saying "Heard your prayer, keep up the good word - Your ever loving Creator,God".
That's kind of in the same league as walking on water and curing people of blindness, if you see where I'm coming from. Getting a car seems a little mundane in comparison. Could be misconstrued by the casual observer as a bit of a coincidence, you know?

I did need the car badly. I had to get back and forth to work. That of course does not deal with the issue you raise, of why God helps some people and not others. The issue of the Mexican drug cartels can be reduced much easier to free will. The freedom of peoples will implies that others could be hurt - without having this freedom human nature would substantially change. God does help people in emergency situations though.

The kids in Africa to feed is a tough one. I don't know why God doesn't feed children in Africa. It could be because of curses on specific nations - in the Bible God judges entire nations for their crimes and their sins go up to heaven so God does not hear there prayers. If he heard there prayers and showed mercy on one individual inside of the nation and blessed them, that would affect the course of that nation, for instance, if he gave them a farm.

In the end, I believe that God will give justice to all people and there will be provision for all who have repented of their sins. Children will be included in that, so children dying of hunger will not be a huge concern. Of course that does not mean that Christians should not be concerned about it, and many are working hard right now and giving and serving to eliminate poverty.

Having a relationship with God though is like you have these sorts of things happen to you all the time and they add up. I have not only had that, I have had people prophesy to me details of my life such as that I "knew how to take a computer apart and put it back together" when I was a computer technician or that "The LORD was contending with me over the issue of food" while I was having trouble controlling my eating. People did not know in either case. I have had hundreds of experiences like this. This is typical for Christians.

I would write it off as a coincidence if I heard someone else talk about it. I am a very skeptical person. But I have had that sort of thing happen to me over and over and over again. Praying, asking God for things, receiving them. It happens all the time. Recieving answers in the Bible. It is real. It is possible to be skeptical when it does not happen to you, but when it happens to you, you cannot interpret in any other way.

[Question Mark]

Kinda makes me wonder if god plays favourites. I mean, did you need that car particularly badly? Surely there's kids in Africa to feed, or Mexican people getting massacred by drug cartels who need saving?

Also getting a car off someone doesn't seem like much of a miracle if you think about it. Getting a flying car, maybe. Or receiving a car with a note on the dashboard saying "Heard your prayer, keep up the good word - Your ever loving Creator,God".
That's kind of in the same league as walking on water and curing people of blindness, if you see where I'm coming from. Getting a car seems a little mundane in comparison. Could be misconstrued by the casual observer as a bit of a coincidence, you know?

I did need the car badly. I had to get back and forth to work. That of course does not deal with the issue you raise, of why God helps some people and not others. The issue of the Mexican drug cartels can be reduced much easier to free will. The freedom of peoples will implies that others could be hurt - without having this freedom human nature would substantially change. God does help people in emergency situations though.

The kids in Africa to feed is a tough one. I don't know why God doesn't feed children in Africa. It could be because of curses on specific nations - in the Bible God judges entire nations for their crimes and their sins go up to heaven so God does not hear there prayers. If he heard there prayers and showed mercy on one individual inside of the nation and blessed them, that would affect the course of that nation, for instance, if he gave them a farm.

In the end, I believe that God will give justice to all people and there will be provision for all who have repented of their sins. Children will be included in that, so children dying of hunger will not be a huge concern. Of course that does not mean that Christians should not be concerned about it, and many are working hard right now and giving and serving to eliminate poverty.

Having a relationship with God though is like you have these sorts of things happen to you all the time and they add up. I have not only had that, I have had people prophesy to me details of my life such as that I "knew how to take a computer apart and put it back together" when I was a computer technician or that "The LORD was contending with me over the issue of food" while I was having trouble controlling my eating. People did not know in either case. I have had hundreds of experiences like this. This is typical for Christians.

I would write it off as a coincidence if I heard someone else talk about it. I am a very skeptical person. But I have had that sort of thing happen to me over and over and over again. Praying, asking God for things, receiving them. It happens all the time. Recieving answers in the Bible. It is real. It is possible to be skeptical when it does not happen to you, but when it happens to you, you cannot interpret in any other way.

Well it's all something to think about, isn't it? The intentions of an apparently incomprehensible being.

I know you and I got off a little rocky, particularly on the other thread, and I probably can't convince you that the majority of atheists aren't nihilists (I don't know why so many christians think that about us), but civility and a stout empathy between us isn't, I hope, beyond us.

You say there's a god, I say there probably isn't, nothing gets resolved, we electronically shake hands and go to bed. Keep the ad hominems in their dens, so to speak.

[EGross]

Faith is the way that people severe there connection with the world around them and become united to the seed of the revelation of God.

By using "reality" instead of "the world around them", (which is basically the same thing, but "reality" clarifies), I could not agree more.

Faith is the way that people sever their connection to reality.

For one to have the ego to believe that the Creator of the Infinite Universe (for lack of a better expression) has planted a personal "seed" or connection into to a believer (or has a personal connection/relationship, like a darling immensly rich uncle), requires a suspension of reality to maintain such a belief.

[Esquilax]

I do not know why some experience more of God than others. It could be due to sin (if I cherished iniquity in my heart, the LORD would not hear me). It could be do to false teachings, and religion.

What an amazing way to continue to believe something, even when all the evidence points the other way; just bounce the blame for failure back onto the people who didn't get the results you wanted!

I do not think that faith is proved demonstrably faulty because people did not get the result that they wanted, or any result that confirmed the experience.

Because that would be a scientific methodology, and if there's one thing we know, god doesn't get along very well with science.

Of course, this is perfectly reasonable, but the fact that many people believe is a form of evidence for the belief, if not proof that it existed. Consider a testimony in a court room. If people simply tell their story, and you don't believe that they are lying, it is reasonble to trust them to a certain degree and seek the matter out deeper.

Ooh, shaky reasoning: the truth isn't contingent on what people think. Large groups of people can still be wrong; after all, I'd hazard a guess you think that anyone following a different religion to you is wrong, regardless of the number of adherents to that religion.

[CleanShavenJesus]

I had a friend back in college, he was hardcore Christian. Church every sunday, pray every night, read the Bible every morning. He also was a thief. He stole anything he could from any store he was in. That ranges from things that were only 99 cents to things that were over one hundred dollars.

This means that all Christians are hypocritical assholes. Since he is one case, I can automatically apply his case to every Christian in the world.



Doesn't sound right, does it? Now picture the same passage, but with "atheist" instead of "christian'". Now it looks like one of your posts, jstrodel.