Can atheists convert theists?

[KichigaiNeko]

Yeah ....

I can't understand that either....

So eager to meet their god yet when help arrives it is declined quite quickly....

[strattosphere]

Strattosphere -

More assumptions. You're assuming that just because I believe in god, that I agree with and would back up everything a christian would tell you. I'm not even a christian, theres plenty that I disagree with them about, so I can't see that happening. And now you're lumping me in with other people, saying that I'm part of a system. This is news to me. Seriously, where are you getting all this stuff from?

You don't read previous posts properly do you. Are you reading through eyes filled with a foaming religious rage?

When I say 'you are part of the system that seeks to make acceptable any kind of belief in the supernatural' I mean that all the religions in the world that have a supernatural deity rely on each other to perpetuate the idea that belief is acceptable. It acts like a mass hysteria system in that children see belief in which ever colour of spaghetti monster is the fashion in their part of the world, wherever they look. The only choice they have is whether to believe in God or not (as long as they are in a country that won't kill them for deciding not to), God being which ever deity their parents or local society believe in. As they get older they may look for other less mental versions to believe in but it's still belief in something other than themselves.

I lump you in with all the other believers because you are all believers! Isn't it just a tad obvious that the one thing you have in common is the fact that you all believe in a supernatural deity? But you must be the only one who's right, yes? So you can't be lumped in with the rest?

Atheists consider all believers to be the same when it comes to faith in an outside creator figure. All faith is irrational, whatever the religion.

[Godhead]

Strattosphere -

No not really, I don't rely on anyone else. Besides, belief is perfectly acceptable. If you define acceptable as what you would accept, that's personal to you. I can accept any belief I like. If you have no means of stopping me from believing whatever I like, then using the word "acceptable" in the context that you mean it, is obsolete. As it stands, I can believe whatever I feel like believing, and it is acceptable because I accept it.

[strattosphere]

Strattosphere -

No not really, I don't rely on anyone else. Besides, belief is perfectly acceptable. If you define acceptable as what you would accept, that's personal to you. I can accept any belief I like. If you have no means of stopping me from believing whatever I like, then using the word "acceptable" in the context that you mean it, is obsolete. As it stands, I can believe whatever I feel like believing, and it is acceptable because I accept it.

Are you actually reading what's written?

Just in case there's any ambiguity, here's the definition of 'acceptable' with regard to religion from the online dictionary:-

to regard as true or sound; believe

So when you say 'it is acceptable because I accept it.' what you are saying is you believe it because you believe it. Redundant!

I didn't say you rely on anything. I said religions rely on each other. Belief in God is deemed acceptable (true or sound) to humans because of history, the amount of believers, religious iconography, the presence of religious commentators and of course family. What this means is that people become aware of the concept of God at a very early age and this normalises it.

When you say belief is acceptable I assume you mean that the idea of a belief in God is thought of by most people as a valid thing. If so then you are generalising. Many people (more than half in the UK) don't find the idea of a belief in God acceptable or valid.

If you have moved from one of the organised religions to the adolescent halfway-house of the belief in a universal consciousness then I congratulate you. Like many before you, you have taken the first step towards rationality and being a grown-up. It hopefully won't be too long before you come to terms with the fact that the universe is not conscious and that there is no God.

[Godhead]

Strattosphere -

Ok so now you're saying that religions rely on each other. That doesn't concern me. Anyway I'm not sure what it is you want. If you want to eradicate religion, you never will. And if you want to eradicate belief in god, or belief in anything which is unproven, again, you'll never achieve that. So all you can really do, as far as I can see, is disagree with those beliefs, while those who believe them continue to do so. In fact, I think that the number of people who believe in any kind of god, or spirit, is increasing. I have no proof of that whatsoever, just call it one of those beliefs that you'll never get rid of.

[strattosphere]

Strattosphere -

In fact, I think that the number of people who believe in any kind of god, or spirit, is increasing. I have no proof of that whatsoever, just call it one of those beliefs that you'll never get rid of.

Spoken like a true believer! Wrong of course. http://www.zenit.org/article-16088?l=english

[Godhead]

Strattosphere -

You're equating belief in god or spirit with religion in particular. The number of people believing in a religion may be decreasing but that's not what I said. You don't have to be in a religion to believe in god. So the number of religious people can decrease, while the number of those who believe in god yet aren't in a religion can increase.

[Samson]

You're equating belief in god or spirit with religion in particular. The number of people believing in a religion may be decreasing but that's not what I said. You don't have to be in a religion to believe in god. So the number of religious people can decrease, while the number of those who believe in god yet aren't in a religion can increase.

That is interesting that you brought this part up, which I have in bold for you.

That's usually the first step in the, so called, DE-converting process...I've known many people to go from being the Church going Christian, to just simply believing in a god/higher power, then after years of this start questioning more things they see from being on the outside looking in.

I've known a few to go from calling themselves a Christian to converting over to some type of pagan break off, which in turn ends up leaning them more to an agnostic view of their understandings.

Either way, it's still better than believing in a god through a desert book that derived from so much hate and in the end tried to ribbon bow tie it with shady love.

[Paul the Human]

You're equating belief in god or spirit with religion in particular. The number of people believing in a religion may be decreasing but that's not what I said. You don't have to be in a religion to believe in god. So the number of religious people can decrease, while the number of those who believe in god yet aren't in a religion can increase.

And you have as much evidence to back that up as you have that god exists in the first place... which is none. Logically... if there are more and more people leaving religion, there are probably more and more people admitting (to themselves) that they do not believe in god.

Let's say 100 people leave a religion and 40 of them are now atheists, that leaves 60 people that believe in god without religion... out of an original 100 people. That does not increase the number of people believing in god. Unless you are saying that these people are somehow converting atheists to join them in their belief without religion... which is ludicrous.

You sure seem to have a lot of "beliefs that you'll never get rid of" even though you have no proof (or evidence) to support those beliefs. Wanting something to be true is not a valid way of deciding to believe that it is. It's childish and intellectually dishonest.

[The Omnissiunt One]

Don't ask me for evidence of god's existence. Just look in the mirror.

Actually, this was how I was first persuaded that there is no god. Believe me, if you saw my face, you'd instantly become an atheist.