(November 4, 2015 at 10:38 am)Drich Wrote: Ah, I see now. You are one who believes the bible was written in english, so when you see what you think is a contradiction, you believe it to be a flaw in the scripture, and don't question the translation.
The Reason I posted the greek was to establish that the "They" in romans 20 means The Evil men being spoken of can be identified/isolated as one group of people. which breaks your claim that their is a contradiction. The only way for you to claim a contradiction is if you ignore both the english and greek and insist that the word 'they in verse 20 actually means 'we'.
20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world,[g] in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
So bury your head in the sand if you like, but your arguement based on 'er-ham's work is at an end.
Still splitting hairs, I see. "They" can also refer to part of your own group, if they are doing something that you have ceased to do or are in some other way distinct. As we have pointed out, the "they" here can refer to those who have continued to act on their "sin nature" by committing evil deeds, while the saved-by-faith have ceased to do so.
For instance:
"My friends and I all attended the football game, together. We all screamed at the big, game-winning touchdown, but I gagged on a bit of pretzel and had to stop screaming after five seconds. They continued to scream for several minutes."
A Christian told me: if you were saved you cant lose your salvation. you're sealed with the Holy Ghost
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
