(February 22, 2016 at 3:31 pm)Rekeisha Wrote: I don't quite understand your view of the creation of the universe.
My view on the creation of the Universe is that it wasn't created. It just happened.
Quote:If creation isn't random then the opposite is true which makes creation planned or purposeful. So who was planning?
"Planned" and "purposeful" are not opposites of random. The opposite of random would be "ordered," or something along those lines.
Quote: This is my proof. The world is not random nor is it made by random means.
That is not proof. That is an assertion that you would need to prove, and even if it were true you would still need to demonstrate why it necessitates the existence of your god.
Quote: It has structure and works in a certain way, because there is a purposeful being behind it.
Oh look. Another assertion.
A structured Universe with consistent laws does not demand an intelligence as an explanation.
Quote: This is why I can give you proof.
What proof? You still haven't shown any.
Quote: If there is no function behind the earth, as you have stated before, then proof is not possible because there is no way that the world should work.
A reality with no intended purpose could still behave consistently, and as long as reality behaves consistently it's possible to prove things. You seem to have conflated purpose with order and meaninglessness with chaos, but there's no logical reason to draw that parallel. Ordered things can still be totally meaningless, and random things can have an intended purpose (like a coin toss, for instance).
Quote: You can't say "that is wrong" and "that is right" about anything. All your evaluations would be arbitrary or just opinions but not definitive, objective, or concrete.
Yet you did say
Quote:While I acknowledge that nature is predictable and that we're able to describe it with natural laws, there is no evidence to support the notion that your Gaud was necessary for that to happen. Quite the contrary, in fact.
would you explain how you see this as possible.
You spoke about predictability from chaos. How can you believe that structure could come from chaos (being the total lack of order). There is no order in chaos, so the only thing there could be, would be chaos. This is why I can say that "with chaos you can't assume or predict".
You seem to have this idea that if reality wasn't created, then it consists only of chaos. That is not correct. A reality with no intelligent creator could still behave consistently. Chaos is only one of a vast number of forces at play in the Universe, and even if the Universe were completely without chaos, that still wouldn't prove a creator in and of itself.
Quote:As for justice, science, and love you are borrowing from my worldview.
If you think your religion invented the concepts of justice, science, and love, then you are a blithering idiot with no concept of reality.
Quote: As you are assuming that there is a function to humans and the world. But if there is no function, then there is no proper way for the world to work. Staying within your view point, love (like justice) works because of society yet society is a collection of people. So what I read and understand that you are saying is that love is a reality because people have "conceived" of this idea, for use as a society, to feel a way about something.
No, you've got it backwards. Cooperative, intimate human interaction is a reality, and love is just what we decided to call it.
Quote:To me, if love is just a mental thing then it is as arbitrary as tinker bell.
Bully for you. Obviously you don't know what arbitrary means.
Quote: Everyone must believe enough in it and when they don't it ceases to exist. That is not reality.
You're so dangerously close to self-awareness that it makes me weep for what could have been if you had just a few more brain cells.
Quote:For love to be real/concrete it must function outside of our own "concepts".
Love is a person, Jesus Christ, who laid His life down for those who were His enemies. That is true love because even if no one believed in it, it would not take away the fact that it still happened.
If it were true you'd be able to prove it, but we've been over that already.
Verbatim from the mouth of Jesus (retranslated from a retranslation of a copy of a copy):
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you too will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. How can you see your brother's head up his ass when your own vision is darkened by your head being even further up your ass? How can you say to your brother, 'Get your head out of your ass,' when all the time your head is up your own ass? You hypocrite! First take your head out of your own ass, and then you will see clearly who has his head up his ass and who doesn't." Matthew 7:1-5 (also Luke 6: 41-42)
Also, I has a website: www.RedbeardThePink.com
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you too will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. How can you see your brother's head up his ass when your own vision is darkened by your head being even further up your ass? How can you say to your brother, 'Get your head out of your ass,' when all the time your head is up your own ass? You hypocrite! First take your head out of your own ass, and then you will see clearly who has his head up his ass and who doesn't." Matthew 7:1-5 (also Luke 6: 41-42)
Also, I has a website: www.RedbeardThePink.com
