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Can a xtian god be free?
#14
RE: Can a xtian god be free?
(March 15, 2011 at 1:57 am)Captain Scarlet Wrote: Assigning a god the supposed attributes of being the locus of morality, omnibenevolent and freedom to act. Ignoring issues with reality are these attributes contradictory?:

0. If a god exists he is the locus of morality, omnibenevolent and totally free to act.
1. As the locus of morality a god could only ever choose to do good things (such that it is necessarily true that, this god cannot do evil things) as determined by their nature.
2. An ominbenevolent god would only ever choose to do good things (or at lest the maximum amount of good things)
3. A god who is totally free to act must be able to choose to do evil things or not maximise the amount of good things that happen
4. A god does not exist

My answer would be: A God (single god of the universe that created all) is free to do what he wants. However, in other sense, if He decides to be in a certain way, then, in this sense, He reduces His own 'freedom'.

However, "freedom" is a complex term (perhaps no one can properly define it) because we also call ourselves free if we "do what we want". But every decision of "how to be" restricts our 'freedom', while if we do not allow ourselves to decide how to be, we are not free, again (i.e. we are not free to decide how to be). So the meaning you gave to the term (or how the term is usually understood) is a paradox: this 'freedom' actually means to be able to do something against your will, without actually being against your will.

Regarding your points:
0. If a god exists, this does not mean He must be "the locus of morality, omnibenevolent and totally free to act";

1. I'd like to know how you define morality first. And how should this be understood regarding God.

2. However, "to do only good things" sounds a bit tricky: should the punishing of evil be considered "good" or "evil"? Because, to punish the evil would mean to cause evil to the evil man, thing which might make the evil man reconsider his behavior (so the result is good), or simply, the ones that suffered because of the evil man to cease suffering (the result is good here, as well). But, if the evil man is not punished, then it is done evil to the people that suffer, because the evil man is left to do what he wants (and he does evil). So perhaps you should say what you understand of "good".

3. "must be able to chose to" does not mean "is forced to chose to..." - you restrict the freedom of the "god" you have imagined.
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Messages In This Thread
Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 15, 2011 at 1:57 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 15, 2011 at 2:05 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Thor - March 15, 2011 at 3:47 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 16, 2011 at 12:02 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 18, 2011 at 1:45 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 19, 2011 at 7:28 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - March 19, 2011 at 8:53 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 20, 2011 at 12:47 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - March 20, 2011 at 4:55 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by theVOID - March 15, 2011 at 3:02 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Minimalist - March 15, 2011 at 3:28 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Anomalocaris - March 15, 2011 at 4:32 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by The Omnissiunt One - March 15, 2011 at 4:14 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by theVOID - March 15, 2011 at 4:16 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by padraic - March 15, 2011 at 7:14 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by theVOID - March 15, 2011 at 7:19 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Anomalocaris - March 15, 2011 at 7:21 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by theVOID - March 15, 2011 at 7:24 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - March 18, 2011 at 12:16 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 19, 2011 at 7:58 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 20, 2011 at 9:05 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 14, 2011 at 4:46 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 20, 2011 at 10:44 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 20, 2011 at 11:08 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 20, 2011 at 11:57 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by reverendjeremiah - March 20, 2011 at 12:10 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 20, 2011 at 12:24 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 20, 2011 at 9:31 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by reverendjeremiah - March 20, 2011 at 5:39 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - March 20, 2011 at 5:43 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by reverendjeremiah - March 20, 2011 at 6:45 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - March 20, 2011 at 8:34 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 21, 2011 at 4:01 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Anomalocaris - March 21, 2011 at 4:06 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - March 21, 2011 at 4:35 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - March 21, 2011 at 4:51 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by reverendjeremiah - March 21, 2011 at 3:03 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Godschild - April 10, 2011 at 5:08 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Captain Scarlet - April 14, 2011 at 4:03 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - April 10, 2011 at 6:09 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Godschild - April 10, 2011 at 11:57 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - April 11, 2011 at 7:30 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - April 12, 2011 at 2:45 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - April 12, 2011 at 7:54 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - April 15, 2011 at 12:13 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - April 17, 2011 at 2:53 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - April 18, 2011 at 4:18 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - April 25, 2011 at 2:47 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Cinjin - April 11, 2011 at 1:51 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Statler Waldorf - April 11, 2011 at 4:19 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by reverendjeremiah - April 11, 2011 at 7:25 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - April 14, 2011 at 5:45 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 14, 2011 at 7:44 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - April 15, 2011 at 3:43 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 15, 2011 at 11:11 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - April 15, 2011 at 6:33 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 16, 2011 at 12:53 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - April 16, 2011 at 5:04 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 19, 2011 at 11:21 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by everythingafter - April 20, 2011 at 7:27 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by fr0d0 - April 21, 2011 at 4:02 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - April 26, 2011 at 1:50 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - May 2, 2011 at 6:02 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by KichigaiNeko - May 5, 2011 at 2:22 am
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - May 9, 2011 at 7:06 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Zenith - May 9, 2011 at 8:24 pm
RE: Can a xtian god be free? - by Ryft - May 14, 2011 at 4:24 am

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