(May 20, 2016 at 4:49 pm)AAA Wrote:(May 20, 2016 at 3:42 pm)Stimbo Wrote: I'm not a designer. It's not my job to make the case for design.
No, but you say it doesn't contain features of design. Then I ask what features could it have that would make it count as design and you refuse to give some. Do you want it to have the ability to communicate using electrical signals? Do you want it to be able to repair itself? Do you want it to read an information dense code? Oh wait, it does all those things. Just tell me one characteristic of a designed sytems that life doesn't have
I don't know what features you'd expect to find that would count as evidence of design, since for there to be actual evidence of design, we'd need to see that something tampered with the natural processes that DNA (and the related chemistry) undergoes.
ID has proposed no such mechanism. All you do is point to anything that's not yet fully understood and say, "There! There's the gap! God's in that gap!", or you try to imply that a high degree of complexity that has developed over 4 billion years can only be explained by outside intervention. There is absolutely no reason to make such an assumption, nor can I even grasp what kind of evidence you'd put forth to try to suggest it is. Saying that it appears to be too complex to have occurred naturally isn't an argument, except The Argument from Personal Incredulity, unless you can show that there's no possible way a natural mechanism could be discovered that would explain the phenomenon... Irreducible Complexity is a poor argument, especially given that all of the original IC systems pointed out by Behe (for instance) have been shown to be naturally occurring.
In that case, you'd have literally the greatest discovery in the history of science-- namely, that magic is real. Everything that occurs without magic is simply biochemistry, and thus not ID. Show me how something could meddle in the pie, and how we'd spot that, and we can talk. "Too complex" is not an answer. "Appearance of" is worse.
A Christian told me: if you were saved you cant lose your salvation. you're sealed with the Holy Ghost
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.
I replied: Can I refuse? Because I find the entire concept of vicarious blood sacrifice atonement to be morally abhorrent, the concept of holding flawed creatures permanently accountable for social misbehaviors and thought crimes to be morally abhorrent, and the concept of calling something "free" when it comes with the strings of subjugation and obedience perhaps the most morally abhorrent of all... and that's without even going into the history of justifying genocide, slavery, rape, misogyny, religious intolerance, and suppression of free speech which has been attributed by your own scriptures to your deity. I want a refund. I would burn happily rather than serve the monster you profess to love.