It's a simple choice:

[scoobysnack]

Sure I guess, but I wonder what it is you think is good, or moral. Many think morals are relative, and good as long as you think they are. Not saying I know you personally, or speaking about all atheists, or even all religious people. Hey, I'm not the perfect person, so I can't place blame on anyone, or judge anyone. Are there universal principles that all humans live by, such as love others as you love yourself, or the golden rule? Like I said, I could pretend to say I live by universal principles, but I'm so far from perfect, but I do strive to be a more loving person.

Well I certainly don't need someone to dictate to me what is or is not moral. Things like the golden rule (or code of Hammurabi) are good guidelines that human societies have built up over the years. It is generally relative in the end, but we all work together to make it flow as a whole. That's how we are both helping ourselves by helping each other. I don't see how a god is required in there.

It is actually a truly interesting thing to think about, and something I could go on about, but I'll try to keep it short for the forum discussion. For example do you see value in harming others to expose them to pain to put pain into perspective, in order to make them stronger and better at coping with the pain they will feel in the future? Could that even be considered tough love? Or do you feel it's better to love unconditionally to treat people or animals for that matter with compassion even if they may not deserve it based on how they have treated you? For me I try to treat others with kindness even though I get hurt by others, but feel like I can rise above the hate by treating others with love even if they have wronged me. Doesn't always happen, and often feel the desire to hate people based on what they do or say, but try to live a life of love. For me God is a good reminder of love, where materialism is what makes me want to act more like an animal and fight to survive.